SPEAKER_01 0:01

Welcome back everyone. Today I've got a special guest. My good friend from dental school, Gunter Streit, Dr. Gunther Streit. First Namubian on the show. First German speaker on the show. Besta. Gunther, thanks for coming, man. What are you doing in Jorba?

SPEAKER_02 0:22

It's great being here, man. Yeah, what are you doing in Jobby? We we decided to the wife and I decided to just take a time out and we're gonna go check out the offspring. Green Day.

SPEAKER_01 0:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 0:34

Um at Calabash tomorrow.

SPEAKER_01 0:35

Oh the FNB Stadium, man. Yeah, yeah. Okay, brilliant. Is that like uh that's rock, rock type of music? What is that?

SPEAKER_02 0:42

That's sort of a punk rock kind of feel. And that's uh so yeah. I mean, I mean Green Day, interesting fact. I don't know, I'm going off a bit off script. Do what you need to, yeah. Dexter Holland, right? He just he's actually professor Brian. He's the lead singer of the offspring. Okay, he actually just finished his PhD about two or three years ago, but so okay. His PhD. So he it goes to show that you don't have to be being cool doesn't just mean being going into music and that sort of thing. Yeah, you can be smart too. Okay. So you can sort of you understand, you get you get that sort of um mix between the two.

SPEAKER_01 1:17

So Gunther, you're a dentist. Yeah. Oh and because you're a dentist, I want to start off by talking about your roots.

SPEAKER_02 1:24

Okay, let's do that. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:25

So take it off here, but yeah, your roots. I mean, take me all the way back. You're from you're from Namibia. Yes, yeah. Grew up born and bred there, or close, close.

SPEAKER_02 1:33

Um I was born in Cape Town and um just before independence, independence of um Southwest Africa back then, um, there was obviously a lot of conflict happening and a lot of unrest. And my folks decided um they wanted to move to a safer environment. So, and then we we uh my father's actually from Namibia, old Southwest Africa, and uh we decided to, or they did, I was only five, um decided to move back and yeah, then I started my primary school back then.

SPEAKER_01 2:04

Okay, so then your folks moved to Cape Town during the unrest. You were born in Cape Town, yeah, and then you moved back to Namibia at the age of five. That's right, yeah. Okay, so from five till polymetric. Do you use it called Matric in Namibia? Yeah. Um what do your folks do? Are they dentists and no?

SPEAKER_02 2:24

Actually, interesting enough. Um, my pops is a engineer. He studied in actually in Cape Town, in Cape Tech. Back then, um the engineers preferred to do this, their degrees and such through the Cape Tech, more hands-on, that sort of thing. The dynamics have changed a little bit. I see everyone uh qualify uh qualification speaks. So so they're moving out to the university thing. It's a bit different, I see nowadays. Um, and my mom has always been into animal welfare and that sort of thing. So she's always been busy, busy with that that sort of thing. So yeah. Are you any siblings or no? Any child, any child. That's why I demand attention.

SPEAKER_01 3:07

Yeah. All right. Cape Town, then Namibia. So what's what's it like growing up in Namibia? I've never been there. Um, is it like similar to South Africa?

SPEAKER_02 3:19

Well that's not 100% incorrect or correct. Haven't you been to Soccermont? No, I haven't. Have you never been to Soccermund? Not even when you were lighting. Never. You must come. Yeah. I'm inviting you in the season. I'll be there, yeah. Alright, so that's a date. 50, you're listening. Yeah, yeah. Alright, so um it's man, I must say, I haven't even done this with my therapist, so it's gonna take me a bit of time, but um, yeah, growing up, typical boy, um a bit of a I had it was a bit tough. I mean, um my family went through a bit of a rough time and um we ended up in some problems, some financial problems. Um and yeah, so so we it was it was quite tough. And then uh went to M Uchinut Primary School and then from there went to VRS, which is the more sportsy kind of high school.

SPEAKER_01 4:13

VHS is is Africa is Afrikaans WHS. Yes, uh that's Vintago school, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 4:19

So you went to the capital cities, the high school of the capital city, and that was the school you wanted to go. Or you know, you know, not just being privy to that, but it's it's um you you I wanted to go to a sporting kind of school, and everyone, my my my father's like, oh, we're ready to get into some poor's because he went to St. Paul's, which is a private English English school. Yeah, and um my mom was like, okay, going to a German school, probably. And then I I said to him, Listen, give me some time this weekend. I just want to, this is before before deciding where I want to go. And then that Monday I said, Listen, I made my decision, I'm going to VIS. I thought my dad was gonna flip. Yeah, he's like, Why do you want to go to an Afrikan school? You can't even speak the language properly.

SPEAKER_01 5:00

I didn't realize this whole dynamic of of language. Yeah. Uh so what uh in the actually are English, but it's more Afrikaans driven.

SPEAKER_02 5:09

The kids there are Afrikaans, that sort of thing. So they they do lecture or teach in English.

SPEAKER_01 5:15

I mean, you've made me think of something that uh we didn't touch on. No, no, no, no. We'll get to that. We'll get to that. But you you mentioned the language thing, and if I if I'm correct, Namibia was a a German colony at one stage, right? So there's a big German population there.

SPEAKER_02 5:34

Yes, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 5:35

So what are the languages that people speak in in Namibia?

SPEAKER_02 5:38

Is it well most most and foremost is English, it is world um renowned language, and then I think secondly it would be German and close on it to yours Afrikaans. Is it? Okay that is the the spoken language, yeah. Maybe and then of course you get to collect or the native languages like Dhamara, um Namad Damara, um your son languages, so sanis your your your bushman. Yeah. Um I actually did a gig with uh with a bushman. Yeah. Oh what do you mean a gig? What gig? Guitar gig. Electronic uh played a bit of electronic guitar. Right. And this guy is amazing. And he's he's never had classes in his life. He self-taught, but this guy can outplay me anytime, any day.

SPEAKER_01 6:23

Um that's interesting. So you're into guitar? Yeah. Yeah, I remember seeing you posted recently somewhere playing at a was it the same gig that you talked about? Yeah, it's the same gig. Okay, but let's let's go back still. Yeah, to to to to the growing up, right? You mentioned times were tough. Now, how how did your parents manage to get you in? WHS sounds like a prestigious school to me.

SPEAKER_02 6:43

No, back then it was a public school.

SPEAKER_01 6:45

Right.

SPEAKER_02 6:46

Um you but they they sort of they sort of pride themselves on selecting the Kremler crop. Uh huh. So the best the best um you had to be good at sports and academics and that sort of thing. So then they were very selective.

SPEAKER_01 6:58

So you were displaying those characteristics where you the top sportsman and a top academic in primary school. Yeah. Okay.

SPEAKER_02 7:05

So you got in. Yeah. So I was I was very driven, you know, and they they actually um and I was always in I was always in the news for swimming and um really really getting somewhere as a as a as a young athlete.

SPEAKER_01 7:17

So you get into WHS, you you you you're shooting the lights out there, also academics and swimming, sporting.

SPEAKER_02 7:25

It got a bit more difficult, yes. Because um as I as I walked into grade eight or you know, your we call it sorter. I don't know, did you sorter? No, I didn't know did you guys ever do that? We had to wear plastic bags on our feet and no, what is that? Like initiations, yeah. Initiations and uh was it an all-boys school? No, no, it was you know, um co ed. Yeah, so so um we had our little name tags and we had to wear but it you know it was actually a lot of fun. I see they don't do it anymore, but but I feel that sort of builds character and it builds that cohesion in your class, you know get to know each other and that sort of thing. Okay, but any case going off off topic now. So um please you can you feel free to feel free to waffle this. This is gonna be like a three-hour three-hour um session here, man. But um yeah, we we um I could start getting better into the swimming. I I um got into SA Nationals already in grade eight.

SPEAKER_01 8:16

Right. SA Nationals, that's but wait, hold on. SA Nationals that tells me South African nationals, yeah. But it's in Namibia. Yeah, how does that work?

SPEAKER_02 8:24

The well, for me to qualify for Olympics and that sort of thing, I had to swim at SA Nationals. It's just the the they've got the right time keepers and and time equipment and that sort of thing.

SPEAKER_01 8:35

Oh, okay. So SA Nationals are like trials for Olympics, but you're representing Namibia. Yeah, okay.

SPEAKER_02 8:40

So you can you can represent your your club, um, you know, like London Finns, um, maybe even Roland Schoolman used to, you know Roland's Roland Schoolman used to represent, I think, um Mr. Prize Seagulls. Okay. Is that a club? That's a club, right? Yeah, in Durban. And um they used they used to usually have it at um King's King's Park. Yeah, King's Park, yeah. King's Park, yeah. Um it was it was great because they really pushed you. We didn't we and and that's what I wanted to get back to is I love Namibia. And that's why my parents brought decided to raise me in Namibia, although we were having financial trouble and stuff like that. And I praise them for it. I really loads of respect for them. That's why I actually bought them a house and they're staying there now. Oh wow, just to say nice thanks. Yeah, and um, and so because it's a the reason why we had to go to Eastern National, so the competition wasn't there, so we really had to um figure out ways, and I luckily I got lots of sponsorships and and really pushed through. And I was aiming for Olympics, which um I just missed in 2004. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 9:47

I think I think it was that would have been probably your matrichia.

SPEAKER_02 9:50

Yes, yeah, yeah. Yeah, but that's good. That's we'll get to that. No, no. That's that's a whole story on its own. So swimming is a big part of your life.

SPEAKER_01 9:57

Yeah, you you you you're really you're making SA nationals and you're about to get into the Olympics and stuff. And academics?

SPEAKER_02 10:04

Academics are strong. Um you must understand that I was away from from school maybe four or five months a year. Okay. School. Actual school and then for swimming? Yeah. And I would sit and and let's say it's like yeah in finals or something, right? Yeah, I'll sit at Oatumba. It wasn't Owatumba back then, it was Johannesburg airport. Yeah, I think it was Jansmatt or something.

SPEAKER_01 10:26

I don't know, I can't remember.

SPEAKER_02 10:27

Perhaps, yeah. Whatever, yeah. And I'd sit there at a table and I'll be studying mathematics because I'm writing at the airport, because I'm flying in straight from the airport to school, write my exams. It was hectic. It was hectic. But it's but it was both script. Did you do well? Or you just scraped it? Um there was a few that you just just get through. For me, getting through was sixties.

SPEAKER_01 10:50

And what subjects do you do in Namibia? Is it the same as yeah? No, it's the same, yeah. You guys said Cambridge as well. I don't even know, man. I just know I did maths, accounting, biology, physics, bio, uh, English, Afrikaans.

SPEAKER_02 11:04

Yeah, six, I did six subjects. Yeah, same, same with us, huh? I just dropped my accounting because I'm dyslexic. Heavy. Okay. So that was torture. You had to credit something and David something. I remember this. I remember this thing. I remember this.

SPEAKER_01 11:18

No, no, we didn't have the conversation. I remember the dyslexic thing because okay, so Gunther and I met at university. And when we used to write, we'll just talk about that. Yeah. Okay, but interesting. So you you dropped accounting because of dyslexia. Yeah. You did just and things weren't adding up. Okay. Um so you were you're passing despite being away from from uh school for like four or five months a year. Yeah, yeah. Um and then like what drew you to healthcare? I mean, did you go straight into dentistry or how does matrick happen? Sure.

SPEAKER_02 11:53

What happens in the um so so this is where it gets. It should be in a novel. I should actually write a book about this. You know, something like Robert Lutland was saying, give it a bit of a twist, eh? But uh but um so so what happened is um my how do I say this without giving too much up? Because there's there's certain parties at play that can, you know, okay can be detrimental. So let's say, let's put it like this. I gave my transcript papers and everything to a certain individual. What do you mean your transcript papers? It's like your you know, like your um papers when you when you apply, application papers and all that, you know.

SPEAKER_01 12:29

Right.

SPEAKER_02 12:29

Well, what were you applying for? I was actually I was actually applying for dentistry. I I just enjoyed it. Um okay, you see. You want to know, you want to know how did I get to that now? Yes, that's what I want to know. What makes you think I want to apply for dentistry? Yeah, no one wants to, right? No. No, I mean not most most people, but what happened is I wanted to do something in the healthcare industry. I like helping people. I was always one of those agreeable, you know, agreeable people, but um just don't don't push my buttons too far. I mean I mean I am I have a I have a bit of a temper and but um you know if you if I wanted to always help people and I like helping people I often got stepped on, you know, that sort of thing. So um my one buddy, buddy of mine just finished medicine. Okay, and he was busy doing his internship, I guess it was an internship at um Katatura Hospital in Vinto. So I thought, no, yeah, so let me this is a perfect opportunity to go shadow someone because we didn't have it, we didn't have it at school. We we didn't have that thing where you could go to where they they tell you there's part of the curriculum or life science or something. Yes, like career planning or whatever. Exactly, exactly. They we didn't have we had something like that, but it was really just sort of just you just had to sit on the boxing exercises type of yeah, you kick a ball around in class and just force out. And I thought then let me just follow, follow my my buddy. Um why did you think to do this? I I wanted to see what it's all about. I wanted to, I thought, no, but I'm gonna I think it's part of my my swimming etiquette, you know, it takes is that if I go in there, I'm gonna give it full on, right? Okay. Um so so I went into this and I When do you do this? In Michig or It was in grade 10-11, round about there.

SPEAKER_01 14:14

Well, that's that's taking initiative. Nobody said to you, Gunter, go do this. No. You just said uh my buddy's an intern, let's talk about it. Let me just go check it out. Yeah. So you're already thinking ahead at that young age, probably. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 14:26

Okay. Um and why, why, and you probably want to know why I was I think that's poverty. We were we we um I grew up in a it things just got worse from there. And um So what are you are you just thinking now how am I gonna support my family or what? Pretty much, and also also how am I gonna I knew if I didn't get a bursary, that's why I did the swimming as well because it was you also get to that hit the wall part in sports, right? Right where you just feel you can't anymore, you just don't want to. And um, I guess it's a great motivator. Fear can be a great motivator, especially if you fail and your dad says he's gonna put send you to the farm, you know?

SPEAKER_01 15:03

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 15:03

You don't want that. I mean, ask kafers.

SPEAKER_01 15:06

Okay, you saw the kafus interview.

SPEAKER_02 15:07

No, you must tell us. I remember when he was watching what was he watching, Izzy Dingo or something. He used to watch Generations.

SPEAKER_01 15:14

Oh yes, generations.

SPEAKER_02 15:15

Oh man, anyways. Um, fear is a great motivator. So, what were you afraid of? I was afraid of failure. Straightforward. What's gonna happen to me? Okay, if I don't get into Vostra, I'm gonna end up like one of these guys that's just get knowing life. And I don't think I would have been like that, but um I just I just wanted to get out of my rut. Okay, I just wanted to be someone, yeah, and I wanted to prove to everyone I could can be this person. Maybe maybe I wasn't born with all the all the luxuries of like everyone else, but like we can be on the same playing level, and I'm gonna show you that we can. And and I'll better you at it. I just had it, I just had that determination. I it's difficult to explain.

SPEAKER_01 15:56

No, no, no, you've explained it very well. Yeah. I didn't I did not know this about you at all. I took you at face value because we met in first year. What is it, first year, second year? We met at anatomy.

SPEAKER_02 16:07

So that's second year, right? I was I was I was giving the presentation because no one because I failed in this. Okay. That's another story, but we that's we met in second year.

SPEAKER_01 16:16

No, let's get to this failing thing just now. Okay. But remind me to talk about because I didn't know that either. But uh what I was saying is like I took you at face value, you're a white guy from Namibia. I'm assuming you've got money and you come from like old wealth, and you know, you were also like very playful and chilled and so you know, you never know all these things. Okay, but but let's go back to grade 10 first before we get to that. Grade 10, you're thinking, I need to figure out how I'm gonna support my family one day. Yeah, I want to go and shadow my mate at the hospital and see what medicines are all about. Yeah. Okay. Can is this something you can do? Because you're thinking, and I don't want to put words in your mouth here or anything, but why medicine? Like, I know you said you like to help people, but then I mean you could have gone, you know, there's lots of industries.

SPEAKER_02 17:01

Could have been a lawyer.

SPEAKER_01 17:03

There's lots of industries. No comment, no comment. There's lots of industries that help people. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 17:09

I was just fascinated with it. I didn't see myself as an accountant. I mean dyslexia. That's out of the business, out of the question, because you need to have your basic accounting in any case. So that really scratches a few things. Um you knew healthcare? Yeah, I wanted to just wanted the healthcare. There was no grace and that's me back then.

SPEAKER_01 17:27

Yeah, yeah, we weren't watching, so it wasn't like you watched Scrubs and thought this is cool. Yeah. Little bit of a little bit of a tangent. Now, why why is there nothing? Like there's no show about dentists, right? Hmm. Maybe we should do that. What do we call it? There is there is at My Family. There is my family, my family. I think it's it. But it's like it's a comedy and it's in the British. Yeah, yeah. But like they portray the dentist as this miserable guy. Who's like his his wife and his kids don't write it?

SPEAKER_02 17:59

So it's you know, it's not exactly the something that's not something you your uh guy in in grade ten is gonna look up to you, I'm saying.

SPEAKER_01 18:08

Interesting. Hmm. Maybe we should go speak to the producers of well how would you make how would you make a show about dentistry attractive to would-be dental students?

SPEAKER_02 18:21

I think it will have to be a mini-series. Yeah. Do I have to be a short? I mean it's dentistry, dentistry has some interesting things. Oh no, lots of me. Amazing things now. It's not just and the reason I say that's been a mini-series because that's been like a documentary kind of feel to it, right? So you you're gonna have to start way back embryology and work your way out. So so um prof now will be very happy with you that one.

SPEAKER_01 18:46

Okay, wait, so we sidetracked. Okay, now we're going back. Going and shadow your friend at the hospital. What's it what katatu, what's it called? Katatura. Katatura hospital.

SPEAKER_02 18:55

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 18:56

And how does it go?

SPEAKER_02 18:58

Um dreadful. Dreadful. Yeah, I mean, for the I followed him for three nights. Right. And I think we slept two hours. Okay. Proper work then, proper shadow. You know, stabbings and blood and you know the words. Namibia has all that. Oh yeah, oh yeah. It just depends on the demographics, where you're going.

SPEAKER_01 19:19

Okay. Well, I think. Yeah, but I mean I look at Los Angeles. No, when I think of Namibia, I think, uh, peaceful, desert, tourist. Okay, but you you have all that stuff also. Yeah. Okay.

SPEAKER_02 19:29

No, it's it's I mean, I mean, you don't go to California and go walk down um Sacramento and it's burning, you know, and you're gonna get burnt. Yeah, yeah. I mean, there's a dangerous area.

SPEAKER_01 19:39

There's a dangerous area everywhere, right? Yeah. Okay, so that it's dreadful. Yeah. And then you say to yourself, This is not for me. Not hap- not doing medicine, not applying for it.

SPEAKER_02 19:47

No. Don't want, don't want this. Um, and then then there was another doctor, uh, he was a orthodontist, and um so I followed him. I thought, hey, this is quite cool, you know? Let me, let me, it's clean, it's neat, and and he actually makes people smile. So that's and that way it's got a lot of medicine in there as well, a lot of pharmacology. I like that sort of thing. So this is the same type of uh in also in grade 10, you're shadowing. Yeah, yeah, grade 10, grade 11. So now we're moving into grade 11. I said, no, I'm gonna do this. Yeah. Put in my application, gave it to this person who happens to be part of my sports community. Let's I'm trying to keep it very vague, huh? Yeah. Um But why do you can not go on? Yeah, yeah, sorry. No, why why do you hand an application to a person? Because this person was going to uh took his the next day. Oh. So either I post it, register, or I'll give it to this chap. All right. So gave it to this chap and I heard nothing, just thought, you know, actually spoke phoned him and said um we came back again. He said, No, he's handed it in. I hear nothing, and uh everyone's getting the application letters. I even got accepted to Bloom already, you know? Okay, and um, but I didn't want to go to Bloom. Oh, so you applied all over? Yeah, I got I got accepted to Martys and then um Bloom, but nothing from Tux. I wanted Tux.

SPEAKER_01 21:12

I just Just for our listeners that might not be from South Africa. Martys is Stellenbosch. Okay, so you applied to Stellenbosch did had dentistry at that time. Stellenbosch had um physio.

SPEAKER_02 21:23

So it was just no, you see. You see, these details I want to unpack. Ah, okay. So you applied for physiotherapy. Second choice, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 21:37

Oh, second choice. Yeah. I don't know. And what was the first choice at Stellenbosch? It was the dentistry, but that yeah, I didn't know that they they did the transition. Oh, they moved to Western Cape. Okay, so basically it just fell through. It fell through. Yeah. So you you applied for physiotherapy at um Stellenbosch? Free State you applied for?

SPEAKER_02 21:55

What Free State was I think it was was uh medicine or something? Okay. So you just plugged in medicine. I just plugged in there.

SPEAKER_01 22:03

Even though you knew like two years.

SPEAKER_02 22:05

Yeah, it's not just I just I just I just I just thought no, I need to apply everywhere, you know? And then just see what I get. And then um and then and then um tox and then um yeah but I was Tux, you applied for medicine also? No, no, no, I just a straight dentistry. And then uh I think it was physio as well. So it was always I you know coming from a sporting background, physio is always the obvious choice. Okay. You understand the muscles, you understand the you're working with athletes, you understand what they're going through.

SPEAKER_01 22:33

I see you getting the picture now because you're explaining why the physio before I can ask because you know I'm gonna ask now why physio gonna come hop in there. Okay, okay. So you apply for all those things and then go on, yeah?

SPEAKER_02 22:45

Yeah, and then I heard nothing from Tix, and I thought it was a bit strange. So um I took our phone admission office and they said they've never received anything.

SPEAKER_01 22:53

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 22:53

So then I went to this person who is very much into the sporting community now.

SPEAKER_01 22:58

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 22:58

And I said, what's going on? And then then then how did it come out? But I found out that he actually lost the papers or something.

SPEAKER_01 23:07

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 23:08

Then then you remember Vintage is is as big as Bloom, eh? So it's it's um not it's not as big as Petoria or Jonasburg. So it's relatively Bloom is big, but it's not massive, right? It's kind of a small-ish community, and this is back then, yeah. Before the booms. So before what? Before the mining boom. Oh. So so it was sort of better, but it's still going on. Yeah. Um and then it came through the grapevine that this chap wanted me to say an extra year to carry on with my swimming. Oh, wow. So you understand how this obviously it's through the grapevine, you hear this, yeah, that so then I I went to this dentist. That's not cool. Yeah. No, not at all. So I was stuck, you know. I was like, okay, well, I wanted to go yeah. I've really now missed the you you've got to miss the time limits where you have to say yes, no, and I've really missed now all the other places. I really, I was oh, so what's happening?

SPEAKER_01 23:59

This is 2004 in my Your Matrichia.

SPEAKER_02 24:01

Yeah. And now I've missed I've missed now, you know, I've missed the application to the deadlines are good. The deadlines to say yes or yarn here. What would you have said yeah to? I would have probably I don't know. To be honest with you, I don't know. Yeah. But I mean it would have been. Maybe, maybe, maybe, maybe, maybe Martis, maybe the physio. What did you get uh accepted for? It was for physio. Yeah. And then um I think it was BSC first in in in um Free State. Yeah, Free State. Okay, but to get into the program of medicine. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 24:34

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 24:35

And then um obviously Well did you do well in Matrix or your Marx? That's where it gets interesting. So I was I just got back from from where was I was in doing the European champs or so in or there was championships in Darmstadt in Germany. For swimming, yeah. And then yeah, on swimming. And then but I didn't I didn't feature so well. Um and then and then I went to the world champs in Barcelona in Spain. Wow. And um Matrichia also. Nonchalant, very nonchalant. So I got a I got a bursary in the States. Right. And um and the the there was a scout and everything. So, you know, I was sort of split between these things. If I felt like I couldn't get into to ticks, I'm not I'm just not going to Okay. I'd rather just go overseas, you know? Yeah. So um, yeah, and then and then I was planning to go to the Olympics, and then we a few things happened that that um prevented me, you know, injury as well and that sort of thing. Yeah. Prevented me from making making the the cutoff for that for that times. Right. And I also I lost the I couldn't get into I didn't qualify for the Olympics. I could have applied even Frankie Fredericks push. Yeah. That's an Amibian spinter, right? Yes, it's I must tell you a funny story about that, Nana. Yeah. Oh man, I I I've got lots, I can tell you a few things. But anyway, so he pushed for me, but it didn't work out. You know, it's all it's it's a lot to do politics. Okay. A lot of things happened back then. Yeah. So it's unfortunate. I don't blame anyone. I know we have to all transition through things like that. Okay. So um we yeah, so I spoke to this dentist, he said no, he understands he also heard something like this. So he made a phone call, and there I was. I was in at Scot um got an application, had a had a meeting, and then it said to me, straight, that you better do wow, otherwise your application gets scrapped.

SPEAKER_01 26:33

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 26:34

So for dentistry at Tux? For for my matrix. Because I actually failed my first year. No, my first done now.

SPEAKER_01 26:40

Hold on.

SPEAKER_02 26:42

My first year you're losing me, Gunter. Wait. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:44

Tell me, explain it slowly to me, like I'm five. So what happened now?

SPEAKER_02 26:47

Okay. So what happened is we we when the papers got my um the application papers for the university. They got they got dumped or whatever, whatever happened. So so what happened is I spoke to one of these the dentists. Obviously, I can't mention names. Yeah, yeah, no, that's fine, that's fine. But um at the university. No, no, at Winterg. Okay. Winter, and he knew someone over there, and then he just got me got my foot back into the door and explained the situation, and we they reviewed all my papers and all of that, and they said, great. But my final that's my final um mark. We have a trimester, we don't have four terms. Okay. Has to be really good. Yeah. Because I failed my first term. Okay, okay. At it because of the swimming and all this. Because of the swimming, yeah. I mean, I just and I think so. I didn't explain myself properly. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So my marks weren't looking great. So I don't even think I would have even managed. Right. But they wanted to see that I could. Yeah. So I I said fine. But I mean now I'm like stuck. It's like, okay, um it's out now. Yeah. You know, I waited too long. Um, other places are out. Now I need to pull finger, and and I did. I really and you you did really well. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 28:01

From the fellow straight all the way. And then you you get into dentistry.

SPEAKER_02 28:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 28:06

Oh, brilliant.

SPEAKER_02 28:07

But I had to, yeah, you really had to prove yourself. Yeah, yeah, of course, of course. One of those things that's if you didn't outshine everyone, this it's just not happening. So your last semester killed it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think I studied more for that than my pathology for yeah.

SPEAKER_01 28:23

Intics, yeah. Okay, interesting. You're talking about uh no, sorry, I was interrupted you. No, no, that's fine. You were talking about um the population of um Winterk being small and or this similar to Bethlehem. I mean, or not Bethlehem um bloom, yeah. Um like Namibia, what's the population of Namibia itself? Is it is it now or back then? Even now, just now for interest. Two million. Two point one maybe similar to Botswana, like tiny. No, it's tiny, yeah. Smaller than Joburg and Yeah, it's tiny, mate.

SPEAKER_02 28:57

Interesting. They they reckon that there's it's the most dispersed population in the wart. Okay. That's what what they said. Interesting, interesting. I say they, but it's my patients, you know. You can't really trust. I need to look up their sources.

SPEAKER_01 29:15

So you get into dentistry now, you are you you're happy. Yeah, yes. I prove myself I'm gonna get there. This is now it's another goal. Who's gonna pay?

SPEAKER_02 29:29

I got a bursary through the through um through my swimming. Okay. So that was tough because I won't discourage it, yeah, but I'm not gonna encourage it either. You understand? I'm gonna be neutral with my own kids. If they show potential and they want to go the same route, by all means, you know, but I'm also I um the they need to decide on their own they want to do something like that, do a sports version. It's not easy because they expect results. So you are training from you're getting up at half past four in the morning, you're staying in a high performance center, you're swimming from five, you get there just before five stretches, five to seven, eight. Then you go, then I need to rush to classes on main campus, and then I'm late for my afternoon classes because sometimes our classes went to what eight, seven? Yeah, well, in first year. Yeah. I I wouldn't know. I never so oh you were just class class was not a thing for me in first year. You just you just have to, but but I had to, you know, you actually had to they'll check, you know. And so so I just I I I just wasn't coping, you know. So I I went to I went to the one oh man, is you know how to walk walk in extra now, but um I went to the one person involved in this in these things. Yeah. And I said, I'm not coping, you know, what what must I do? And um he said to me that you know what I've got a I've got a potential because this was after I think it was How St. James or something like that, you know, one nit um for the university and stuff like that. And I was just but my I was very disappointed in my time. And um I said, I'm just not coping, I'm not getting the times and that sort of thing. And he's Oh, coping um sporting-wise, yeah. Well, everything balancing, you know, it was it was crazy. I I I I I barely have a memory of what it was, what it was like. You know, it was like just trying to Where were you staying? I was staying at they've got a lot of um sports houses around L C De Vilius. LC Devil's is like the sports complex at the University of Pretoria. That's 100%. Yeah. And um we would get meals cooked for us and proper proper meals, healthy meals cooked three times a day.

SPEAKER_01 31:37

Um you know what I didn't know, I didn't know any of this about you. I didn't know that you that you were doing all of this in first year. So you you came in on a swimming bursary, yeah, and they put you up at the sports complex. Yeah, they have expectations you've got to meet in order to maintain this bursary. That's right. Yeah. And if you maintain them, then the bursary covers what?

SPEAKER_02 32:00

What is it? Um, well, your accommodation, your studies, you know, all those, all those things. Um lovely. So no, it's great. I mean, I mean, it's great if you're studying sports science.

SPEAKER_01 32:11

Okay, I get you. I mean, uh well, I don't know. Do you mean like if if the course that you're studying is manageable?

SPEAKER_02 32:19

I was the only one not studying sports science. Okay. I think there were one or two physics, I might might be wrong, I might be talking on correction, but the people I knew were all saying sports science. And um, I'm not saying I'm not nothing bad about their course. I think it's great. I mean, I thought um Lisa Marie Retif, she was one of the Olympic South African swimmers. Um, I think she was, she did butterfly and stuff, you know. And um she did she actually did the sports science first and then went into medicine. Um, but I just didn't want that, you know. I mean, come on, imagine doing your sports science and then going into the industry or medicine after that. I don't think I could I don't I know you have to know yourself to to to get somewhere, you know. You have to know where you've been to go forward, sort of thing.

SPEAKER_01 33:06

So it's a battle now, balancing the sport and the work. Yeah. And you go to you reach out for help and you say, I'm battling here to somebody who's who who can help in the campus. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 33:15

And then what happens? So this guy at the sports facility said to me straight, he's like, um, you know, he sees a future in the in the sports. I must can I must quit my my studies. That's what I thought. Yeah. You know, my I think my eyebrows just went up higher than than yours, you know. So yeah. So I'm not sure. But I mean, but I'm keeping face, you know. Why? Why do what why do you react the way I reacted? Because I was I th I was expecting maybe some empathy and sympathy and something, you know, just just some understanding. Well, I mean, the guy clearly has belief in you, he thinks you can take this far. I guess so. Yeah, uh it was a humbling experience at the same time. Yeah, that's a great thing to be. But it's not what I wanted. How come? I wanted to if something happens to me whilst I'm swimming, fine. You you get the sponsorships and all of that fantastic stuff. And what happens if you hurt your knee the next day? What then? Yeah. You lose that sponsorship, you it's it's quick cash, but it's not it's not gonna hold.

SPEAKER_01 34:19

So you're thinking about sustainability and you're thinking about supporting family, and when you're 40 years old, you won't be swimming and things like that. Yeah. Exactly. So that's why your reaction is eyebrows raised.

SPEAKER_02 34:30

That's not what I remind. Okay, okay. Um I I'm sure we could work something out, but it's I could, you know, back then I always I always say I like to be the dumbest person in the room.

SPEAKER_01 34:42

Right.

SPEAKER_02 34:42

Because then I can listen to everyone.

SPEAKER_01 34:44

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 34:45

And it's and it's like being the the owl. Yeah. So I listened to all of this and I said, okay, cool. I'll go back and I'll give you my answer tomorrow. I packed up my things, went to administration, stayed at Olympus. Olympus is the medical res residence.

SPEAKER_01 35:00

Yeah. Okay, what what is it? So what are you saying? Tell me what do you say?

SPEAKER_02 35:04

So what happened is um I dropped it. You dropped this the the swimming thing? Straight. Spoke to my folks, said I can't do this, we'll work something out. Sure. Just like that. And the money? The bursary? Doesn't it fall away? Yeah. Okay, so the folks So we had to so we had to take loans out and and all of those things. Okay, okay. It gets tough. And then they eat that dude.

SPEAKER_01 35:26

You told them how did they react when you told them, guys, they dropping this thing.

SPEAKER_02 35:30

They they obviously they're worried, but they didn't they they didn't say anything. I knew. Um, but I you know, took student loans out, they took loans out, and we we worked, we worked it out. Okay, brilliant. But it eats it, yeah. It really, it's really at the back of your mind. Anyone that's had to take a student loan knows. And I think that is one of the contributing factors why I think a lot of people s suffer from almost an overwhelming experience and why people will actually fail a subject because you start, you know, you know, when you study, when we did dentistry, we have had many conversations like how the heck do they expect us to get all of this in our head? We just learned and they want they expect an exam a day before spring day or something.

SPEAKER_01 36:14

Yeah, the audacity, the audacity. Just to just how inconvenient. Yeah, or how convenient for them. But did you pass first year? Yes. So okay, so you managed with the swimming, you passed and everything. Then you decide, okay, then you say can't do this, not gonna happen.

SPEAKER_02 36:31

Halfway through when we're moving to main campus. Because that even got worse. Because now how do you manage transport?

SPEAKER_01 36:38

Oh, yes. We were on main campus, yeah. Right. So second year, you're a student loan person. You where did you get a loan from the bank or how does that work? Yeah, loans from the bank. Okay, okay.

SPEAKER_02 36:53

Yeah, that's um yeah, that's student loans and you you um you know it is. It's just I don't, I I don't, that's why I'm asking. Oh, is it? Yeah, you guys. This might help people um who are concerned. Yeah, you apply and you you have to write obviously my back then I'd run motivationally. I was quite fortunate because the bank managers were friends of my parents and knew me as well. So that's in Namibia. In Namibia, and that's why I try and stress to people, and there's something I also learned only later in life, is how important networking is.

SPEAKER_01 37:22

Okay, people relationships and networking.

SPEAKER_02 37:24

Exactly. Business networking is important. People don't think I'm I'm I'm wasting my time, but it is important. You need that support. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And if it wasn't for that, I don't think I would have got a great loan.

SPEAKER_01 37:36

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 37:36

And then loan, like obviously it's just an is it just a normal financial thing you get paid off after after your studies, and you you obviously have to contribute to it to keep the loan open.

SPEAKER_01 37:47

But does it take it takes a while to pay back okay? It's uh I don't want to be I don't want to probe too deep. I mean if you've paid everything off now, stuff long time.

SPEAKER_02 37:58

Um so so it was yeah, it was it was good. Um it does eat it too, and then um having having stress with with my I've never I've never actually told people this, but I've I had so much stress back home and stuff like that that it actually but I never I always try to show stay face and you know sort of been the clown in class because it kind of made me feel better to try and forget about things. Okay. Do you understand that's in the background?

SPEAKER_01 38:23

Yeah, I mean I was unaware of this. I thought we knew each other relatively well. Yeah, I didn't know any of this and even nobody was coming.

SPEAKER_02 38:30

I just I always kept that very separate from everyone. So my my I must actually send this video to my therapist. Maybe you can maybe get through this.

SPEAKER_01 38:41

Um okay, where were we going? So now dental school second year starts. That's that's when we meet, right? Yeah. No, we met I felt my second year. Okay.

SPEAKER_02 38:52

Anatomy. Right. I actually felt anatomy um in my second year. That it I scored an extra year.

SPEAKER_01 38:59

Oh, is that how you ended up in my class? Yes.

SPEAKER_02 39:02

So you were a year ahead of me. Yes. Oh, I didn't know this either. Yeah. Okay. And then um that's where I had to that's where we met on that day. I uh that's where we're getting back to it. Um I was kick I was actually nervous because how many kids are in that class? Like 300 or so in anatomy. Yeah. It was like a lot.

SPEAKER_01 39:19

Oh because let's explain to the listeners and the viewers. So, like in dentistry at the University of Pretoria, the first two years are basically we are the same as the medical students. It's like meds, pre-med something. Well, it's not called pre-med because it's it's it is they have medicine and they we have dentistry, yeah, but for the first two years we do the same subjects. So we're all in the same class. I mean, uh going to all the same lectures, so it's quite a big class because medicine is big. Oh, yeah. But dentistry, on the other hand, is tiny.

SPEAKER_02 39:50

It's like our dentistry is tiny.

SPEAKER_01 39:51

Yeah, well, we were like that's generally in the whole country. In the whole country. Like I think the biggest uh dental school is probably UWC. 110 or is it 110 or something? Yeah, they're quite that's a lot.

SPEAKER_02 40:02

I tried counting the other day. Okay. Yeah. Um I might be wrong, but yeah, maybe let's check it out. We'll check it out.

SPEAKER_01 40:09

But it's tiny compared to medicine and compared to university when you think of university. It's not like you're uh another number in dentistry. Like people know your name and your face. But if for the first two years we all combine. And so that's where you were saying it's a big class full of kids at uh in anatomy. Yeah. So you fail the second year anatomy. Yeah. I pass pathology. Yeah, you pass everything, but you fail after anatomy.

SPEAKER_02 40:33

But that that was also one of those things where you you you you look at. Like my parents are always on my head, of course. They wanted me to achieve, they wanted me to get proceed, go further than I, you know, almost like the the Troy and Hector in in sort of thing. So so um they but I mean then you have this freedom and you don't know only child, um slightly on the spectrum as well, that sort of thing. That's also why um, you know, and you you you struggle with struggle with relationships and that sort of thing. Okay. Um and you yeah, so so you just you just don't know where to say no. Alright. And obviously too too much too much friends, you know. You gotta you must you must make sure you keep your friends, you know. It's important. But um where do you draw the line? Three o'clock in the morning? Yeah. No, it's an everyday, no. And that's where I I didn't draw the line, and I made a terrible mistake. So, in summary, then you you you're partying a lot. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 41:38

I'm trying to make this eloquent. In short, you're catching a jaw for the first two years. Drop zone. Oh, okay, okay. Where I dropped my phone. Okay. Well, that's why they call it drop zone, I guess. Other things get dropped there. Um, okay, partying too much. Yeah. Uh overindulging, you're away from home. No, no, no one to watch anymore. Yeah. Freedom. Freedom. Freedom. But that's what I was saying. I mean, in first year, I uh when we were talking about you were asking me about the classes, what time honestly, I hardly went to class in first year. Oh, right, yeah. Because you don't have to go to class. It's like they don't care. As long as you pass. So in high school, you you have to you have to go to every class and then suddenly you're away from home, you have all this freedom. Nobody cares if you come to class. Yeah. As long as you pass, right? Yeah, yeah. So I was hardly ever there, and that's probably why I was also, you know, scraping things. Yeah, yeah. Okay. Fail anatomy, and then you get it, then you st you have to stay back a whole year just because of one subject. That's not the sad part of Pretoria, University of Pretoria, right? Yeah. Um, okay. So that adds on a year for loan payments and oh yeah.

SPEAKER_02 42:46

That's yeah, I had to pay myself. The banks don't. That's one thing you guys need to remember is if you're on a loan and you fail yeah, they're not gonna cover you for that skipped year. They give you, they set it. If your course is five years, that's five years. Uh-huh. Finish it.

SPEAKER_01 43:02

All right, all right.

SPEAKER_02 43:03

So if you have to score extra year, so yes, dude, I was working like four jobs and you know, trying to pay that back as well. And okay.

SPEAKER_01 43:14

So we meet second year, right? And we were in dental school then from there onwards. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 43:21

That's like end of second year, third year, swinging, swinging that side.

SPEAKER_01 43:25

So, what are your memories of dental school? Wow. The good, the bad, the ugly. I want to know it all.

SPEAKER_02 43:31

Okay, so let's start with the bad. It can only get better, you know. But um, so I remember a few times where you and I, I don't know what that happened there. We just we just didn't want to study. I don't know what happened. Yeah, we like get too.

SPEAKER_01 43:48

Don't don't rope me into this guy. Me and this guy. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 43:52

Just this Indian guy.

SPEAKER_01 43:56

Was I the first Indian guy that you met? Pretty much, yeah. Yeah, yeah. I never I never really we we don't have any people in Namibia.

SPEAKER_02 44:03

Really? Yeah. So so you're and you're you're quite interesting. So I thought I'm gonna stick with this guy. This guy's cool. I like him. And um so oh yeah. So I remember me and this inn guy. Yeah, um, we have no clue what's happening in this in this test. You know, obviously we started, but we just, you know, ah, oh my words. Um, you know, oh my words, we're gonna we're gonna fail this, and you know, my dad's gonna kick my bum, you know, and I'm gonna go to the farm, you know, that sort of thing. And yeah, walks in Kavir, you know, we're like, Kave, come here. And he's like, hey guys, how are you doing? Like, no, no, kids, sit, sit down. And then you'll you'll freak out says, Did you study? Always, did you study? I'll never forget that. I love that with the eyes open and all. And you're like, no, we didn't. Now sit and exp, you know, then you'll go through the whole syllabus. Yeah. And you would spot well, right? Yeah. You can say what you want. So like I was good at spotting.

SPEAKER_01 44:52

I remember the USP's days, yeah. They were stressful. Look. Fly united. But but it goes back to the thing about relationships that you said earlier, right? We we all need a cavir in our life at one stage or the other. Yeah. Because not everybody is going to be 100% prepared for not necessarily exams or whatever, but whatever the situation is. Yeah, whatever life can trage you. You can't do things alone. And Kavir took the time to say, okay, you guys clearly needed this, let's focus on that. Yeah. Figure it out. Okay, so you remember those are the bad memories, like battling through it, not being prepared, not necessarily. I think in court to the dense office and me that one time. I don't remember that. Okay. Uh maybe better. Yeah, but but the point is, okay, and we were unprepared because when you're in university, when you're in university, nobody is there to say sit down and study or make sure you you know you've got to take the initiative and and and if you don't, then you fail. Yeah. Simple as that. Yeah. Okay. Bad memories. Um, what about sexual dental school?

SPEAKER_02 46:00

Like uh man, okay. I remember almost getting um hit, you know, involved in a hit and run with a guy on a scooter that's about this big. Yeah. He's taller than me. Oh, I know where you're going with this.

SPEAKER_01 46:14

Mr. Prof. Dunheimer. Yeah, prof a good prof. He used to dri ride a little scooter in campus. Yeah. But he and he was our odontology.

SPEAKER_02 46:23

But he he he just made it for me.

SPEAKER_01 46:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 46:25

You know, he just that guy was amazing. I mean, he's he's hope. I think he's still around. You know, he's old, it's old back then. Yeah, he was good. He he was good, man.

SPEAKER_01 46:35

Man, what did you enjoy in dental school? Like, what did you think? Um was there anything that's that stood out to you and made you think, okay, when I'm finished, this is what I'm gonna do. Or no. No, I went with the business. I love the honesty. Yeah, no, because that's exactly my answer.

SPEAKER_02 46:50

No idea. I hated it. I'm being okay. I hated every moment of school. 100%. Um I I I I really did not like orobiology, you know. I yeah, although now I find it interesting. Okay, but that's academics. Yeah. But um like I'm talking about even actual actual cleaning. No, no, I mean I cleaned, you clean my teeth. We had so many questions cleaning each other's teeth that we realized we're like, yeah, we've got this.

SPEAKER_01 47:19

You know what? You make me feel better because you know, I mean, I think I've said this on one of the I mean, I didn't enjoy dental school.

SPEAKER_02 47:26

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 47:26

But I always felt like I was probably in the minority because I looked around, people were very enthusiastic. And yeah, you know. So you could be this. Um now look, I I know we're talking about all this stuff, right?

SPEAKER_02 47:42

Yeah, we're just reminiscing over these things. It's amazing.

SPEAKER_01 47:45

Yeah, and it's make and a viewer might think, now these guys, well, that explains why Yash like left industry afterwards and became a lawyer and all that stuff.

SPEAKER_00 47:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 47:54

But I was very surprised because we didn't really stay in touch after university, right? No. And only recently I discovered that you've got like postgraduate, like a I can't um like I think four or five postgraduate diplomas, but six. Six, huh? Six, we'll get to that. Yeah, and like, and I thought, oh my gosh, how changed? But people do change, right? I mean, you when you're in undergrad, you're young. Yeah, we're gonna be the criminal coming back from prison. I wouldn't uh reform, reformation, you know. No, the thing is, right, you we're young in campus, it's like our first time away from home. We're adjusting from to that, adjusting to the freedom, and we and you know, you you grow up and you mature, right? So it's not like I'm bad I left the industry practic practicing dentistry, but I found something that I absolutely loved, and I was the opposite where I was like top of the class. Yeah, I got letters from lecturers and stuff, and you know, yeah. So clearly something happened there. I want to get into that transition later. Okay. But you ready for it, still? But but part two. But no, and there's no intermissions here. We've got enough time to record. Yeah. So, Dennis, so what is motivating you to carry on in dental school? Probably just to get out and get a job, or what is it? Oh, where are we now? Great. No, we're back to university. Final year.

SPEAKER_02 49:11

Let's just say final yeah. Yeah, man. I mean, you we we had this, you know. I mean, yes, I remember you and I just breaking down with each other, you know? I mean, not in the sense that bad boys too kind of break down, you know. Um anyways, um, but but the the sense of that we we just feel overwhelmed and we just feel like we're inadequate. Yeah, I really felt inadequate. Yeah, I felt like and and it's I felt like the the third wheel all the time. Yeah. Because look at I'm coming from Namibia. My parents brought me up English. Yeah. I am a Virto. Yeah. I had to put it in there, you know. A bit skizzy, but stay with me, right? So and and then, and you know, where do I fit in? Yeah, come on. I didn't I didn't really I didn't fit in with really anyone.

SPEAKER_01 50:00

And well, but you were at the University of Pretoria, there were a lot of white guys there. I mean, for people that don't know what virto means, it means white guy, right? I mean the the capital of India in Durban. So so so but you felt you didn't feel part of the industry.

SPEAKER_02 50:14

No, I didn't. Me neither, me neither.

SPEAKER_01 50:16

You also didn't get the I never felt a part of the industry at all.

SPEAKER_02 50:20

And I was just doing it to to because I think it's like your primal instinct in in a human being is to set goals, work to that goal, and finish it. Finish it. Okay. And I wanted to finish it. And towards the end, you know that I even you know, I think it's part of the sports in me. Then I started switching over year by fourth, inner fourth year, fifth year, maybe after my in, you know, I only had one girlfriend got married to her. Yeah. So it's always a good, good, good boy. And um, so yeah, and then I started withdrawing a lot because I started becoming very hyper-focused on this thing. You know, I just wanted to finish and get it done out there. And then what I wanted to also tell you is that um the biggest mistake I made was quitting the swimming. I wanted to, I forgot to tell you that. Because I went through I went through heavy, heavy post-Olympic depression. Okay, and that is what that is what the swimmers get, or not swimmers, just anyone. Because all of a sudden you you you imagine this. You you're on the blocks, you walk jumps, you're hitting, you're training, everything, everything stops all of a sudden. And and mental health-wise, that wasn't good for me. And it started getting bad for me here by fourth year, fifth year. Right. I started breaking down. I couldn't understand. I had no help, yeah, no supports, you know, you understand, you know. See, I had no idea about I'd just sort of be the emotional support for my own parents. I had to be emotional supports, you know. I had I didn't. To take care of yourself and others, and there's nobody to support you. That's yeah, I'm not I'm not trying to be a crybaby. You didn't even know about it. Yeah, I didn't know about it. No one knew about that.

SPEAKER_01 51:55

I don't think no, I don't sound like you're being a crybaby. It's good that you're explaining these things because somebody might be studying. And also good to good for people considering these types of things to know the struggles that come with it, right? And what you're getting yourself into. Yeah, dental school. I actually remember now that you mention it, you used to have sleepless nights before clinical um things the next day, especially if it's like the first time you're gonna be doing a specific type of procedure. Yeah. You know, you don't know how the patients are gonna react. Because dentistry is the type of thing where you can be as prepared mentally as possible, but you rock up there and patient doesn't pitch. Patient doesn't pitch. But if the patient pitches, they might not open or might have pain, or they might just be they might just have a complete flip high station. You know, so as you never know, it's so unpredictable. And dentistry. And and that uncertainty. I think it's probably one of the like the most stressed difficult undergrad degrees. The doctors will come at us now when we say this. That's fine. So dentistry I've got it's you're sitting there and you you've got to get your thing done in a small confined space. Yeah, somebody's watching over you. And uh no, no, it it goes back.

SPEAKER_02 53:07

And it's not like a soft tissue where you we if you don't cut 100% correct, that soft tissue is not gonna close. No, it's it's it's hard tissue. And if you don't do it 100% correct, it's there for life.

SPEAKER_01 53:21

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 53:22

There's that's that's what I always think of, you know.

SPEAKER_01 53:24

When I wow if you could go if if you could go back to like your younger self. How young? Yeah, in dental school. Okay, we're talking okay. Dental school, what would you say to that to Gunter there, like now if you could go back? Probably something like that. I should have had a mannequin.

SPEAKER_02 53:43

Well, okay, for those that are not watching, Gunter just like smacked his smack myself, yeah. What what would you say? Well that that would just pretty much just get yourself right. You know? Yeah, knowing case get your get your get yourself together. Right. Um and and stop being, you know, um just do it. Okay. That's it.

SPEAKER_01 54:04

Just do it.

SPEAKER_02 54:06

Okay, I'm glad you're talking about it.

SPEAKER_01 54:06

So it's not like you're saying going you're gonna go back to him and say leave and and change degrees or something.

SPEAKER_02 54:11

Yeah. No regrets. Because I have no no, not at all. I would brilliant. Because I believe what Yeshina I was. I wasn't I I I I I had a difficult time. All right. And a lot of people thought I wouldn't make it. And you know, it was there were stalks around then. I thought I'm just gonna be useless. They thought we were gonna be pretty useless, you know?

SPEAKER_01 54:31

Yeah, well, uh look, I scraped through every year of the industry, not because not because I tried, but it's it's actually literally for lack of effort. I just wanted to get through it and over with it. Yeah. Um, so yeah, understandably we weren't the we weren't the model students, we weren't the top students.

SPEAKER_02 54:47

But we're good with our hands. I mean, we could we could do do the thing you're doing. I I didn't raise myself, really.

SPEAKER_01 54:53

Yeah, it's fine.

SPEAKER_02 54:54

But but the one the point you were making is the point I was making is that um we No regrets. No regrets at all, because we have to sometimes we have to go through this hard. It's even and it's a spiritual being, you know, and I I believe that we we have to go through this course, we have to go through these struggles to find out to understand. I call it I call it the sitting on the bed mythology. Okay. You sit on your bed and you let's say you pray to your God. Yeah. Um, and you have to have a real but it's not the it's not quite the same. You have to have a real one-on-one with yourself, and you have to be dead truth to yourself. You know, you're gonna you're gonna hate it, but you have to be dead honest with yourself. Yeah, what are you doing wrong?

SPEAKER_01 55:38

Yeah, okay.

SPEAKER_02 55:40

What are you doing wrong? Okay, and you have to be dead honest and not and not try and have this virtues of you know, of pride and stuff like that. That's out of the door. Be honest with yourself, what are you doing wrong? Only when you know yourself can you improve. And I only realize that later in life. I realized that when I got I was out of out of comp serve everything. Then that's and that's where it comes to my studies. Okay, wait. I got to know myself, right?

SPEAKER_01 56:08

Right, right. So we painted a bleak picture.

SPEAKER_02 56:10

Yeah, so there's a lot to it, right? I just thought I'd break it like that. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 56:12

I like it, I like it. We painted the bleak picture because it's good for people to know that that's how it was in undergrad. That's how the dental career of Dr. Gunther Streit started. You know, it's it's not like it was all hunky-dory and glamorous and brilliant. It's like it was looking negative. It was looking negative. Yeah. And you don't know what's gonna happen afterwards, right? Exactly, yeah. Well, now there's some light because we we we're moving on, right? After graduating, 2010, you graduate. Yes, yeah. What happens? What what do we do?

SPEAKER_02 56:43

Well, I missed my ceremony. What your graduation ceremony? Yeah, okay. Yeah, the one the one at our dental campus. The oath taking thing. Yeah. Because um my parents' flight was delayed. Oh my goodness. Like by three or three hours or or something, something happened. And um I shows you how much attention I was paying that day because I didn't I can't even remember. Yeah, but I also but I also wasn't, you know, it's really just like okay, I'm done with this. And over. And it's quite sad because um, you know, you only appreciate you appreciate a view from a distance. Yeah. Now that I'm further away, I actually appreciate what those profs and those guys, they were good. They were that is a good school. I don't care what anyone says.

SPEAKER_01 57:25

The University of Pretoria.

SPEAKER_02 57:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 57:26

Oh, of course. They they have who says otherwise? Do people say do people say otherwise? No. Oh, okay. Because you said I don't because you just said I don't care what people say. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 57:34

No, I'm just I'm just in case they want to say something. Okay, okay. It's a it's I think it's one of the best, yeah, for sure. And I will stand by it. And I'm yeah, I'm glad that you also say you also stand by it. And and they are they are good. I was I I was it the thoughts are all on me.

SPEAKER_01 57:49

Okay. Personally, on that note, I don't I think that it's not about the school, it's what the student makes of it. Exactly. Um but I don't want to digress too much. So that's the thing. I I don't think we uh I don't think I would be a great ambassador for dental school if you look at me, the quality of product that came out straight out of undergrad. But there are people like prof Glenn Buchanan, who was in our class. Yes, Glenn Buchanan. Now he's top of his game. Yeah. So it's really I genuinely believe it's what you make of this. Exactly. Um if you're interested in it, you you'll do it and you'll you'll excel in your field.

SPEAKER_02 58:31

But anyway, let's let's And I mean uh uh Glenn is even going to Sydney now. Yeah, yeah. He got ex he's gonna go teach there now.

SPEAKER_01 58:38

So yeah, I mean he must he's no no the but this is what I'm saying it's it's the the student that makes it the quality. Okay, so 2010 you graduate, you miss your ceremony, all that stuff, and then ComSurf starts, community service. Where do you go? What do you do? Aramula.

SPEAKER_02 58:53

Okay. That's why I was getting back to that point earlier. We you and I were according to the principal's office and we thought to ourselves, oh my goodness, what did we do now?

SPEAKER_01 59:03

I don't remember this now, okay? You don't remember this? No, is this an embarrassing story? Or so yeah, let's and then and then we're gonna see you tell the story and I'll see if I need to find it out.

SPEAKER_02 59:14

If it if we just say so for law, but then you do. I don't remember this. Tell me that the Dean's office. Yeah, we'll go to his dean's office and then and then Prof Lucht on him, looks at us and like, oh my goodness, you know, maybe we did something because I mean we had a bit of a reputation. Come on. No, but we yeah, I don't remember this at all, but we were tell the story. I mean, we we were not bad boys in a malicious sense, but we weren't like you said, we weren't the modern students. Exactly. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 59:38

So if we get in call to the dean, we're thinking we're not thinking we're getting an award or something.

SPEAKER_02 59:42

No, yeah, that's the point you're making. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, so like uh we we need to figure out what what could have happened. Did you what did you do? What did I did did uh we injured patients? What about that cut the other day? I'd go on. Yeah, I can't believe I don't remember this, but and then and then he's he tells us um yeah, um our applications and workouts or something, you know, for for community service.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:04

For community service. Pause there, because not everybody knows about medicine, dentistry, and quite a few of the healthcare um professions. After you qualify, you've got to do one year of community service. Um it's not free, like they pay you a salary, it's a really good salary. But you you go to you know, a state facility, sometimes very rural, sometimes urban, and you work on patients that are state patients, not private patients. Okay. So we get called into the dean's office. We're thinking, oh my god. Yeah, we're wondering what's going on. This is the end. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:41

You know, we've found something and then we were told, okay, fine, our application. I don't know. I think we we we chose probably Durban Cape Ton, whatever. Yeah, yeah. It doesn't matter. They were Oh yes, you've just got this drive for hours. Yeah, yeah. Hours. And then and then he said, No, you you here's your new here's your um page, new page or something, and here's mine. New form. And then no, but it was already it was already done. It was printed. And we're like, and I got this. And I look, Adamla, don't think he's in myself.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:11

Oh, so where's so he's giving us uh so we applied because we yeah, you in that time, I don't know how it works now. You have to apply for where you want to go, and he obviously I went and applied for Durban and all that. Of course, and you don't get that because the whole world is applying for that.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:24

Exactly.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:24

So oh, so Prof. Loch Telem gave us and said, This is what you've gotten.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:27

Yeah, and you know, we were just we were just unlucky. You remember memory is really bad. Yeah. And then you got I got Ermelo. You got Ermelo, I got Stanerton. Yeah, St. Anderton. You need to make it. St. Anderton, St. Anderton. You probably didn't.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:41

All right, okay. So it wasn't such a bad story. I'd uh No, it didn't.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:44

But it actually ended up much more pleasant. Right.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:48

So you get Ermelo and I just remember thinking I've never heard of Stanerton. So had you been to Ermelo or never. Okay, but I couldn't even find it on the map. It took me about an hour. But but you went and and how was it? It was good.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:01

Yeah. I sat in I went there, I sat in the most dodgy place because I couldn't start the hospital because it was really fully um, you know, uh full of doctors and but there was no vacancies there. So I had to get private residence. And you you know, you move into town, where do you stay? So I said in this really dodgy place, and I never forget. Um they they left me alone. They thought, no, you know, a Vitto coming here, he must be dangerous, you know. And just kidding. Yeah, and then and then um I made friends with um, she actually became my best mate at my wedding. Right. Um, Riley in Grundewald. And her father was really hype in the police force. I mean, this guy was like one of really I'm in Amler. Okay. And so my car broke down and I needed to lift home. So he he drove me home and um in in the police van. And these guys were parking on the on the fence uh on the on the wall next, you know, next to my little flat where I was staying. And and he drove on the pavement to come drop me because I could go through the through the street. There's a gate to go into my my flat. And these guys just peeled, right? Yeah, they're like everyone gone.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:09

I can see them everywhere. So that's the area you're living in, kind of area. And how is the work? I mean, how did it um get like your expectations versus reality?

SPEAKER_02 1:03:20

It actually just got worse, dude. What dentistry? Yeah, because we were just seeing a hundred patients a day or really you know how many of you were there? Dentists. Five, six, five or six dentists, yeah, quite a big facility. There was quite a few, yeah. But we were we were in the middle of of the the location. The location is um like the township type of thing. Yeah, oh yes, of course. And um so we we had to drive there every day in the middle there. I didn't think I I didn't think I don't think we even had a working wind turbine drill, nothing. Just biceps. Just extractions. That's it. For whole year.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:58

Oh yeah. Never did a filling, never did a dension, nothing.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:02

Nothing, nothing, nothing.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:03

So do you know how many teeth you extracted or poured? I've got a bottle at home. Winter, okay. Is this something maybe cut that out? No, we'll leave it in. We'll leave it in. All you said is you've got a bottle at home, so it's fine. Um okay, so how many teeth did you extract? Like, you you wouldn't account it. You didn't do stats and things. No, no. Did you have any other responsibilities besides clinical work or was there a manager clinical?

SPEAKER_02 1:04:27

There was a manager there, very cool guy. Um uh Farouk Sotov, very nice guy. And um Is he still there? No, he's he's also moved on to private, huh? Okay. Someone's Johannesburg, I think, no.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:40

And ComServe, so you're making good money. I mean, we're earning money, right? Yeah, yeah. And it's proper money. Yeah. For a first you know, straight out of university, I don't think there's many. I don't know, maybe I'm wrong, but you're earning good. And you and you your costs are low, presumably, but you've got to pay for your loan and things like that. Yeah. That's different.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:59

How did that which actually my my parents took on themselves? Okay. Then out of out of it, they they paid it off. So you uh chilled. You became I became chilled after that. So what were you doing with your spare time and spare money and all that stuff in the commservia? Oh, I was trying to I think I was just trying to serve it up, right? Okay. And then um just make my own way and just just. What were your plans? What was the pl what were you saving for? I wanted to come back to Namibia to oh yes, I actually forgot to mention. I even just remembered now. Yeah. The last two years I actually got a bursary. What's the last two years of dentistry? Four and five, yes. I actually got a bursary. Well, with what now? Um through a dentist in Wind Turk. Yeah. So that that saved me a lot because then we could help pay back the loan. That I forgot about that. So that that really helps me. That's lovely. So by that time the loan was not finished paid off, but it was it was actually getting there. Um, and I think my parents were just Hallelujah. This is this is done. Um and it was nice because they didn't I didn't they didn't have the pressure and you know that sort of thing. But um that's okay. Interesting. That's lovely.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:14

Yeah. And then because so comms. Yeah. Comsurf now you you you're pulling through and you're pulling teeth. And it's like pulling teeth, as they say. Yeah, I don't know. Are you looking for are you looking forward to it ending or what are you looking forward to? Oh yeah. I just want this to end. Why? What do you want to do? It's not fun.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:31

I mean what did you want to do thereafter? I actually wanted to do it all.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:34

Okay, no. No, you're just making this stuff.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:37

No, I'm being dancers. I'm being dancers. I actually wanted to do it. And then um why but you wanted to did you want to leave dentistry? I wanted to leave dentistry. That's that's really was it that bad? It was bad, dude. Just putting teeth, seeing rotten teeth, and yeah all day. It's just you know, you're not you're not enjoying the science at all.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:56

I'm loving this because I know how your career is ending up now. Yeah. So it's really interesting to see that you got to a stage where similar to me, you're like, I actually want to leave. Okay, so tell me about this law thing now.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:10

Oh, right. So so I got and then I heard you did the same. It was just weird that you you also went into that direction. I thought, wow, you know. Maybe it's contagious, yeah. Yeah, yeah. And um, then I met a guy, a day, old dentist in in Armula. Yeah, and he sort of took me under the wing, and I got to he said, no, this is what it's all about. Then I started realizing there's more to it. Yeah. And um, and that's also where I've mentioned this to you before, where he said, you know, you don't have to be the best dentist, because we all get to that level where you're good, you're adequate, you have to have passed, you must have done something. Um, you have to be good with your patients. And and then he just showed me the ins and outs of the industry, and that's where it's sort of changing.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:57

This is during concept, what do you end up? He's running his private practice there, and you're sort of like shadowing and things like that.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:03

Just watching what he's doing, and um, just just seeing, yeah, seeing what is what is private practice all about.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:09

So that helped you stay in the past.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:11

Yeah, yeah. Wow. And um Yemen, he his son is actually my age. Yeah. But Yemen and I became best friends. Okay. He's like as old as my father, you know. So it's like a is he like a mentor, or would you call it like a mentor type of thing? He became my mentor. And that's important, I think.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:28

And I was lucky. Did you keep in touch with him? So Compserv ends after a year. Yeah. Then you keep in touch with him or Yeah, we still kept in touch for quite a few years.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:38

What's his name? I mean, you can say it is no. Yeah, it's uh Chris Chris Pullen. Chris? Chris Pullen, Dr. Chris Pullen. P-U-L-L-E-N. Yes.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:47

Oh well, kudos to Dr. Pullen. I mean, for keeping Dr. Strite in. He could have ended up being a lawyer. You know what I mean? So well done. Dr. Pullen, and congratulations for being a mentor and getting this guy to stay in. And we'll talk now about how it only goes up and up from here. I think. From what I I have I looked at your CV, so I think it really looks like you have gone up and up. So was that was like Dr. Pullen's intervention type of thing, like a breakthrough for you. I want to I can stay. Yes. And I can be a dentist. 100%.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:20

That's brilliant. He did a he told me about this thing about doing postcard. I didn't even know you could you could do stuff like that. I'm like, well, what's a postgrad? That's how much attention I spend in paying attention in class, you know, or in life. You know, I just didn't have a analytical view, I didn't have an idea of what was happening around, you know. So he explained to me. He did this postgrad in in orthodontics, and we started going through author stuff together, and then I realized, wow, I could focus and do and focus on one thing and study it and and move on like that. And I'm like, this is fantastic. This is and that's where I started loving the academics. Do you think Dr. Pullin will watch this episode?

SPEAKER_01 1:09:58

I hope he does, but you should share it with him, please. I can, yes. Because I think he he deserves some credit for um keeping somebody motivated. Um because I left. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:12

Why did you if you had a mentor in your final so I'm I I know I'm the you're the presenter, I'm I'm the you know. Yeah. But um why if you had a mentor, and I'm just changing it up a bit, in your final year, like I had with Chris. In my final year of dentistry? Come on. Oh, you mean in commune? Let's say you had someone that really took you under the wing and said, hey man, check this out. It's not that so bad. I I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 1:10:40

I mean That's a tough one. It's a tough one to but I I'd made my mind up six months into ComServe. Oh, really? So I actually started studying six months into ComServe. I applied for my LLB degree six months in. Yeah. And I started studying then. Oh right.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:57

So I knew very early. There was no But your daddy's most uh turn, yeah? Yeah. Okay. Oh but that's obvious. Then you you sort of slide into that.

SPEAKER_01 1:11:06

No, it wasn't obvious because then I would have done it from the beginning. Yeah. But um, I don't think a mentor would have been able to talk me out of it. That's too far gone. It wasn't it wasn't for me. Uh but we must share this episode with Dr. Pullen and and give him the give him the kudos that he deserves um for turning things around because there was a big turnaround.

SPEAKER_02 1:11:28

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:11:28

I mean, I can see, I mean, I've seen it. Yeah. Um so but you mentioned something very interesting. Like you were telling me about how you weren't paying attention and you didn't know about postgrad and you didn't know about all these opportunities, right? And it makes it makes sense to me because I feel like just having listened to your story, um it's like uh you got into dentistry uh just by chance almost. I feel that that's what I really growing up saying, I want to do this X, Y, and Z. Yeah. You sort of went with the motions and you got in, you didn't get in, you're gonna do physio, you're gonna take it, see where it goes. And it's easy to just let life take you and go, right? So I'm glad you met Dr. Pool and he showed you about you about postgrad, he told you what the opportunities are. Perhaps some people get that in undergrad. Like some lecturer might take them under their wing. We didn't really have that much per se. I don't know, or did you? Not really. I don't think so. With the with the postgrads now? No, in undergrad, like when we oh no, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:12:40

Um I must say uh a shout out to remember prof boy, Sonia.

SPEAKER_01 1:12:45

Oh, yes, Sonia Boy, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:12:46

Um yes, guess you know, she was our prof. Her husband is prof Senkum, okay, who was my wife's professor. Okay. In veterinary science.

SPEAKER_01 1:12:59

Oh, your wife's a vet, eh? Yes. Did she study in Pretoria on the stubborn?

SPEAKER_02 1:13:03

Yes, yeah, that's right. Sure. I mean, it's just a small word, so I just wanted to drop it in there. Oh, it's so they know each other, and then she was she really sat me and spoke, sat with me and spoke to me the one time, and it was I had a lot that and who was the postman? Yeah, yeah, prof he's now prof Postma. I said prof now. Yeah, good, good for him. And then White, Prof. White, yeah. And obviously Dynama and Buteau, I think those were the main Kurt Buteau, yeah. So he goes, and there there was another guy there, man.

SPEAKER_01 1:13:31

Um Valley, Valley. Yeah, Dr. Valley, yeah. Yeah. So there are people that they want to take you on your way, but at that young age, also, you know, you need more. Yeah. And look, you did ComServe, you thought you were gonna leave. Yeah. Then eventually you find this private practitioner, Dr. Pullen, and it's just change things. Okay. Yeah. So then you decide I'm I'm staying, I'm gonna be in private practice. What happens after ComServe?

SPEAKER_02 1:13:52

So now you have to obviously have to honor your obligation to the to the um loan or the um bursary or whatever. Oh, yes, adversaries. It's very complicated. I had to work back with the interest, right? With the the dentist in the Mobia. That's right, yeah. Okay. So um and you're a fantastic guy, love this guy to pieces, you know. Um, so he dropped and I I I call him my symbatical, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:14:23

Yeah, you're sabbatical, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:14:24

Yeah, because they they dropped me off in a place called Khababas. In Namibia? Yeah, Khababas. If anyone of you want to have a comparison, it's probably like Pofara in South Africa or something. Bethlehem. Are you trying to say it's a small town? It's small, it's tiny. I lasted there three 13 months and I said I couldn't say.

SPEAKER_01 1:14:44

That's long though.

SPEAKER_02 1:14:45

Over a year in private. Yeah. And it's it was it was hot. It's a beautiful place, beautiful people. I just you know, coming from a big town, and yeah, yeah. And now moving to that, it was it was yeah, but too much of a cultural show.

SPEAKER_01 1:15:00

Well, you're saying coming from a big town, Ermelo is a big town. Yeah, wow. If if if that play, yeah, if Ermelo is a big town for this place, yeah then tells me how small it is. Yeah, it's uh okay. So you're there for one year and one month, private, then what happens? And then are you enjoying it?

SPEAKER_02 1:15:14

I joined it was cool. Dentistry, yeah, it was very cool, right? And then I did a lot of author, and then I I think that's where I did my first uh post grade in aesthetics with oh Dr. Brunt, Paul Brunt. Yes, remember him?

SPEAKER_01 1:15:27

Yeah, yeah. Dental materials in undergrad.

SPEAKER_02 1:15:30

Do you remember? You asked me what was a time that I remember from dentistry. Yes, he was marking our papers one time, yeah, and he rushed out the day before saying, and because his um his sausage stock gave birth to puppies or something. Okay, no, I don't. Okay, so um he came back, he said, Okay, listen, who's this guy? Because he had to take a whisk, he had to point out a uh a uh whiskey. What? Because I had such a bad handwriting. Oh, okay, okay. I don't know. So I just thought I'd put that there. Then um yeah. So you did postgrad with him? Yes, I did it with him.

SPEAKER_01 1:16:04

And aesthetics. Postgraduate diploma in aesthetic dentistry. Oh, really? You did a great job, eh? Okay, and uh so it's like cosmetic work type of thing. Cosmetic work, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:16:14

Botox one year or two, how does that one one year? All right. Um no, you went through it all way. Um Botox, obviously filling, smile line, whatever. Yeah, all the all of that, phot photography as well. And um I wrote an article, then you know, we have to present in art school for the for the to satisfy the the diploma. And then after that, but I was really now working Warpish Bay, and then and then I did another post postgrad at at UWC for author. I think that was intercept of author.

SPEAKER_01 1:16:49

Autodontex, yeah. And then uh So while you're working in private, you just randomly every now and then you go to Cape Town and Vitoria. What's the point of these things?

SPEAKER_02 1:16:58

For you specifically. I feel I feel I miss I missed out at Vast here because I was just overwhelmed. Right? This way I could learn things on my own. Okay, so it's now I've got control. Yeah. I'm in control of my life scenario now. Yes. And that's I like that. Okay. I mean, and um, yeah, then I was doing that, and then um when something significant happened in my life, then I almost I had a major I had a major um bike accident. I was I was doing a lot of off-road biking and jumps and that sort of thing. In Namibia. In Namibia, yeah. It's I moved that time to to soccer soccer months with a girlfriend at my at that time. Yeah. Well, man, I'm I'm gonna tell you that story later. But in any case, so so I met this girl. Let's let's quickly go back. We'll get to the motorbike part quicker now. So I met this girl in a bar.

SPEAKER_01 1:17:49

Right.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:49

And my mom, being her only child, guess what? You know, your mom's gonna say, you never pick up a girl in the bar. Okay. But it doesn't count because Jersey house, sort of like a restaurant bar sort of thing. Okay. So I'm staying with her because I I bought this property, this house, um, building this house in um Mirsech, which is in Wafflesh Bay. Okay. Um, double story, very nice place. And then um, but it's they they're behind contract in our boarders all, right? Okay. So I've got no place to stay. My my contract, the rent, the place I'm renting is inning now. Yeah, the place that I'm building is is only finishing in nine months. Yeah, yeah. So I've got nowhere to go. So this girl phones me out of the balloon, you know, but not even dating, anything. It's like I just think about it. Um, I I heard you had a problem. Canandre, why don't you come stay with me? You know what this I did the smart thing. I put the phone down quickly. I needed time to figure this out. You know, I found my pops. I'm like, this and that, you know, this chick I barely know has said this. He goes quiet. It's like, what's your problem? Yeah, just take her up on the offer, you know. So I said so I moved in with her, you know. Right.

SPEAKER_01 1:18:51

But just you know, as a share the rents now, 20 2020, 14, 16, 2016. Somewhere, somewhere there.

SPEAKER_02 1:19:00

It's it's a bit hazy there. And um, okay, so um, I'm enjoying the bikes now. I I like the the MX jumping and stuff, and then I take a wrong jump and file 20 meters of this bike on my leg that they were thinking of wanting to amputate it. Really? No drugs. Shh. And um it's spiral fracture, compound, yeah. I've got a pin leg. Yeah, got a pin from my knee all the way to my foot, keeping it together to this day. Um so so um that's I was stuck in, I wasn't allowed to move out of my bed for three months. Right. That's how about the accent was.

SPEAKER_01 1:19:37

Hopefully, you've got disability insurance and things like that that pain. No, yes, I did. Okay. Yeah, yeah. So yeah, because I mean that can be that's devastating to a dentist, right? You can't do it, you have to be there to do your work.

SPEAKER_02 1:19:49

You can't work from home. It was the PPS. I'm I mean, I'm not this is not a sponsored event or anything, but PPS really, really helped me out there. Yeah, and then um, yeah, then I did another postgrad.

SPEAKER_01 1:20:01

No, I'm just laughing. The fact that you're saying it's not a sponsored thing. Thank you. Thanks for clarifying that's putting it in the list.

SPEAKER_02 1:20:08

You might just get we might just pull out this sponsored by PPS. So so oh yeah, so I couldn't do anything, I couldn't get up on my own, nothing, nothing, nothing. That's how it was bad.

SPEAKER_01 1:20:22

And who was taking care of you?

SPEAKER_02 1:20:23

This girlfriend. Okay, and she had to wash me everything, eh? So then after this whole thing, I decided, you know what, I might as well get married to this girl. Okay, and you know, and that's how it worked.

SPEAKER_01 1:20:33

Oh, and that's the girl not that you say this girl. Yeah, it's your wife. It's my wife. Oh, okay. I thought the story was going somewhere else. No, no, that's and we that's the veterinary. Yeah. Yeah. Now you guys uh what you've got kids and we've got two beautiful daughters and um pets.

SPEAKER_02 1:20:49

Oh man. Too many. Too many. She's a vet, so I'm assuming. Oh man, too many. But um, we've got uh you know uh uh very uh Rottweiler with a hearing problem. Yeah. I mean that in a colloquial term, it's just this dog does not listen.

SPEAKER_01 1:21:05

Oh, you mean like that? Can hear but just doesn't listen. Yeah. So now what's the conversation like at dinner? I mean a vet and a dentist. Okay. So wait, wait. Because at least her patients don't come there and say I hate you. Like, why why do dental dental patients actually say I hate the dentist? They come to you and they say I hate you done. Do you have any idea? It's not I'm not the only person that's experienced this. I know I've spoken to many dentists. Everyone like dental patients feel the need or like to say I hate dentists. Just to voice it. To sit on the chair and like I've never gone to professional and say I hate ex profession.

SPEAKER_02 1:21:47

Maybe it's maybe we're living in a society where people just don't respect the doctor. Do you think doctors do you think doctors should be respected? I think so because why? Because we work our butts off. Okay, but so do No, I mean I think a professional we should actually respect each other.

SPEAKER_01 1:22:06

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 1:22:07

But that is not here, I don't agree with you. That is but that is not happening in nowadays society. Yeah. I think it's falling beyond. I think your your core values, it's it's out the window, dude. Okay. You don't see I mean this sort of thing. If I spoke if I spoke to let's say Chris, this th 40 years ago, they would never say that. Oh, Chris, Dr. Pullen. Yes. Okay, yeah, yeah. There was no such thing like I hate the dentist, you know? They might make it as a passing comment as a joke, but not you know, not that flat blank, straightforward, you know, sort of thing. I get you. And then I say to them, you know, my comeback is yeah, sometimes I say don't worry, the feelings mutual. And how do they react? They don't know how to react because it's it's it's it's there to put the spanner in the in the gear. Okay. Just to put them off course that's that it's it's not you know, just to let no it's not okay with that.

SPEAKER_01 1:23:00

Well, I wouldn't recommend you say that to patients, but I mean it's that's my official line.

SPEAKER_02 1:23:05

But it's it's it's it's not it's not meant as a threat or anything, it's just it's sort of trying to break the ice, you know, sort of thing. Then then I'll tell them come come let's chill and we we develop a I don't actually measure them, I don't work on the patient. Now I think that's how you break it, break that.

SPEAKER_01 1:23:21

I love that you're getting into this because I actually was literally going to ask you the next question. It's like what's your approach to patients and caring for them? So how do you patient comes, sits down, or how do you deal with them?

SPEAKER_02 1:23:32

I I hate the word rapport. You hate the word? Rapport. Rapport, okay. Um, I want to develop a relationship, right? A professional relationship, right? A trusting relationship, and now we get back to respectful relationship. Only once you've got that, try it. So how do you do it? I get to know, get to know them, get to ask them. I generally want to know about you. Yeah. That is who I am. That's also why I became a doctor. I like I like people. I like to know who are you? Tell me. Oh, what do you do? This and this and that, you know, and um then I tell them about myself, but we get to we get to that baseline. And then you move on to the next thing. Why are you here? Tell me, what is what's happened to you? Why this and that? Just that if I can understand what's happened to this person, I can control the story, the narrative. What's where where is this gonna go? Okay. And and then we we we work together and we f we've we form a respect, respectful relationship after that. Then we we meet, you know, it's and it's all in a professional sense of the being. Yeah, yeah. Meaning that that I say, listen, this is what I see, yeah, you know, and and I break down and I go through it step by step. I spend about an hour. Yeah, just on an if a patient wants. Yeah. Obviously, they store their own boss, and if they just want me to drone for, that's also fine. But I love it when they when they want to take the time.

SPEAKER_01 1:25:02

How do you have that comp do you sit them down on the dental chair, like or do you guys sit on a normal chair first before you how does it?

SPEAKER_02 1:25:10

You sit them up and on a normal dental chair, but I come around. Okay, and I sit eye to eye. Like I say, how how's things going? And we we just I'm that I'm in this space and I'm I'm here for you. Forget about everyone. Tell me about you. This is your time. Forget forget that we're running beyond. That I can wait to it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Tell me, I want to know about you. And that's people seem to respect that. Do they appreciate that? They love it, it really works.

SPEAKER_01 1:25:40

And um Is that what you think maybe like can set you apart? Not you specifically, but anyway. A person, a dentist apart from another dentist?

SPEAKER_02 1:25:48

For sure, 100%. And then once you start running your practice like that and not a sausage mall, yeah. Sausage factory, yeah, you start appreciating it. Yeah, you start you start really understanding helping people. Um I mean I'm getting very serious. No, no, I like this.

SPEAKER_01 1:26:03

You know, but yeah, it is we have to be serious. I mean uh a lot of people will say to you, but we don't have time for that. Like, I don't have time to spend an hour talking to a patient because I've got to bill and run a business at the same time, also. So, how do you balance that? And do you how do you think that's a good thing?

SPEAKER_02 1:26:20

Lawsuits also take time. Lawsuits that also takes time. Yeah. So if you don't understand what the patient wants and body relationship, it can go either way. And I'm I'm being and I'm I'm you as a lawyer can hopefully also, you know, you understand and respect what I'm getting at is um know the patient and have full consent.

SPEAKER_01 1:26:41

I fully I fully get that. Yeah, and I I you know, in an ideal word, say spend as much time as you need, right? Yeah, but ultimately you're also running a business, a private practice. And can you make it feasible like to have those long conversations? Do you control how much you charge or is it medical aid rates? Medical aid rates. Um The doctors in South Africa complain a lot about medical aid rates. Oh, really? Funding and you know, yeah. We're in the same boat.

SPEAKER_02 1:27:08

Same boat.

SPEAKER_01 1:27:08

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:27:09

But you make it work, even with the time that you take. I think where where things come where it's different is I spend the time and I kind of said as all those cavities that you're gonna miss, you've now picked them up and you've really studied this patient. Now this patient is you've made a trust and it's easy to work with, and and then it goes easy. You know, you've got to you're gonna as a lawyer, you don't charge the patient or the person straight straight away and you know, unless you've had the consultation. I mean, that's how you make your money, right?

SPEAKER_01 1:27:44

Okay, it depends where you go. We charge for every SMS and WhatsApp and email and everything. That's why Oh, is it? Is that why they're called you shit? Yeah, no, but I get what you you look, so you need to first time. Exactly. But you But it's an investment. But what you're saying is it's workable, like you Not going to bankrupt yourself by doing that. No. So you can still do it.

SPEAKER_02 1:28:06

Because now you're moving away from a crisis management to management case.

SPEAKER_01 1:28:12

Okay. So you've done like six postgrad now. Yeah. I think so. Yeah. Orthodontics, aesthetic, dentistry, pd pediatontics. Yeah. Whatever, all these things, right? Where are you going with this, Gunther? What's the end game? What's the well at the moment I'm busy with my PhD.

SPEAKER_02 1:28:33

Your PhD? Yes. Can you believe it? Imagine this conversation.

SPEAKER_01 1:28:38

Yeah, no, I would have thought if if if we were in 2010, Kavir would have laughed at us both. Yeah. If we had to say Gunther's going to be a PhD. Is it a PhD in dentistry? Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:28:48

Not some random law or something. We we we or philosophy. Philosophy, I love that. No, it's um I'm doing it through the University of Unem. Um University of Unem. That's Namibia. That's University of Namibia. Yeah. And um fantastic prof. He was absolutely very cool, cool people with um with um prof. Prof. Buchanan as well. Glenn, which is a man. Yeah. Yeah. We just we just mentioned now. We were in the same class as this guy. Yeah. So how does that work? In Namibia, is it linked to University of Pretoria? No, he's just a super supervisor. Okay. But because he's done something similar, yeah. Um Quentin Vessels, that's my main supervisor. In Namibia. Yeah. He was actually also from FromTox and he you he went overseas and came back and sorry, but um so he's my main supervisor, and my second supervisor is actually Glenn.

SPEAKER_01 1:29:41

And okay, and what are you doing? What is this PhD in?

SPEAKER_02 1:29:44

It's on root canal systems, um, where we we're sort of mapping out the amount of root canals and trying to trying to predict. Let's say let's say you've got a one-one in the front death. What is the prediction going to be in this population so that you can make an informed decision?

SPEAKER_01 1:30:03

Gunta, Gunta, slow it down, dumb it down for the non-dentists. Oh, geez. Oh so every tooth has a root. Every tooth has a root. Everybody knows what a root canal is a root is, and inside the root is a canal. That's right. And different teeth have different um shapes of canals. We call it morphology and all that stuff. There's different structure. But uh upper left first molar generally has similar types of variations of morphology and structure. That's right. Yeah. Did I do it okay? Did I do it okay? 100%. Okay. So now your PhD is about?

SPEAKER_02 1:30:42

It's about, it's about I'm actually wish we had a somewhere. But let's say, let's say we have a we have a tooth, right? Yeah. I'm gonna look at all the teeth from from your first molar to the front. So the meaning your first chewing tooth to the front, sort of thing. Yeah. And then we're gonna look at we're gonna look at um, like you said, the the insides, what's happening there? Is it is it one going all the way down, entering the body, or is it splitting, or what's happening? And through that, we're gonna put it through a database, and then and then and then we're gonna do some some statistics with that, so to speak. Obviously, I can't I can't go further than that, but that's it, okay. Is it like classified? It's not not classified. It's it's um it's it's quite technical, yeah. Okay it's quite a it's quite a thing. Um and it's part of the thesis. I first first need to complete that and then we can we can have this conversation afterwards.

SPEAKER_01 1:31:39

When do you think you'll be done with that?

SPEAKER_02 1:31:43

Never. Um That's a good idea.

SPEAKER_01 1:31:46

I think apparently that's a lot of PhD students think they'll never be done.

SPEAKER_02 1:31:49

You you just yeah, it just feels like it's a bottomless pit at the moment. Um I mean um I'm hoping end of next year, maybe?

SPEAKER_00 1:31:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:31:57

Just with a data just with the data collection, right? Not that's not writing it up, but how do you collect uh the data? Uh well I've got I've got uh my own CBCT and I've had it for that's a CT machine, like a scanner. Sorry, yeah, that's a 3D, 3D scanner. And I've actually got a lot of um scans from there and uh a couple then just in Vintuc have been sending me work scans. So you scan live patients. Live patients, yeah. You know, if I'm gonna do a root um uh implant or or or whatever, you know, or there's a pathology I'm not too happy about and in your private practice. My private practice. So you you I always say it wrong. It's not analyze it, it's you you you you make it anonymous. Oh anonymous, oh anonymize it, anonymous and you anonymize it. Okay, anonymize it, and it's every it's just a number. Ah, okay, okay. Um yeah, it's like it's amazing, isn't it?

SPEAKER_01 1:32:52

So like we were painting the picture of these useless students in undergrad.

SPEAKER_02 1:32:57

Because that's what it was, right? Um you being on the head of the, you know.

SPEAKER_01 1:33:03

No, no, no, I'm not blowing. Okay, no blowing smoke. Um and now you're doing a PhD in the industry. Like it's amazing. It's amazing what one person can do, yeah. One person can you what do you really think it was Chris Pullen who was that one person when you say one person?

SPEAKER_02 1:33:18

I think he was the antagonist to it, yes. Oh I think I think he was just that person. Oh the catalyst, the catalyst, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. He's just the person that I just needed I just needed that, yeah. And um, yeah. Amazing, amazing, amazing. Changes things, eh?

SPEAKER_01 1:33:32

Networking. Brilliant. Networking, mentorship, helping, helping colleagues. Exactly. Now let's outside clinical work. All right. What do you what do you do for fun? What interests you? I saw you posted something on YouTube, skydiving. I mean, are you a big like um? No, I did it.

SPEAKER_02 1:33:51

I did it once and yeah, and I I I I I don't think I'll do it in a hurry. But I'll get if you come, we'll do it together. Okay, so it won't happen. But it's free if you do it naked, eh?

SPEAKER_01 1:34:02

Really? Or are you just talking about it? I'm dead serious. Okay. That's not gonna happen. Clothed or naked. I don't see the I mean I know people that do it. Doesn't appeal to me. No, it's not so what do you do for fun? I mean, you play guitar, you posted that thing of the gigs.

SPEAKER_02 1:34:16

Um I actually I that is I love that. That is cool. Playing guitar. Um, I do the I do box guitar like normal, and then then I love just grinding it up. You know, if you stress at work or anything, best way to get rid of your stress is uh sports, swim, or whatever, and just jam. Just just just hook it up to the amp and you just let rip. Disturb the neighbors, especially when they had a 21st party the night before and you're in your early bird.

SPEAKER_01 1:34:45

So guitar and uh you still swim and stuff, play sport?

SPEAKER_02 1:34:48

Yeah, yeah. Four or five times a week I try. Really? That's a lot. Okay, yeah, you know, swimming or what? Swimming, yeah. I try and get about an um one and a half to two Ks in every day.

SPEAKER_01 1:35:01

Okay. And do you did you like do you do training of students and mentorship and all not yet? Or is don't you have to do that?

SPEAKER_02 1:35:10

We're talking about swimming or dentistry now. Both, anything. Yeah. I did a bit of um training for for kids for swimming. Yeah. Um, but you know, Yesh, you know, time just runs away with you, eh? Of course. It feels like the older you get, so you you just you your time just you know, your family demands it. It's it's tough, eh?

SPEAKER_00 1:35:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:35:29

Um dentistry and stuff, we we well I did a mentorship thing or um for advice team. Yeah. Other than that, um I get a lot of phone calls in the morning from from colleagues, for instance, um, especially younger, younger guys that are struggling. And um, before I even start, and they'll tell me what's going on, you know, they'll just they just want something to talk to. What's your favorite type of like clinical work to do? Like, do you love root canals or I love I actually like believe it or not, I love doing root canals. Yeah. Um well, I mean, I just assume if you're doing a PhD in the in the I love it. No, I really I'm glad that you asked that. I love doing root canals. I think it depends on how how how things are going. You know, some some days I love doing implants, some days I love doing ortho. So that's why you do all the stuff, yeah. I do all of that. So that's why I can't just do one speciality or so. I like I like to just what's what's something that you'd least look forward to? Least extractions. Really? Okay, that's just that's obvious.

SPEAKER_01 1:36:34

Yeah, I mean you've done enough in Ermelo. You've yeah, I think I've been there done that's made the quote, so you know. Okay, all right. I mean, what's the long-term goal with this PhD? Is it just to keep you occupied or no?

SPEAKER_02 1:36:48

Um I'd love to I if again this conversation year end with anyone in our class, you would laugh. But I enjoy the academics. I really enjoy the academics, but I I want to do like like Croft Peter saying, you know, where we're in a favor. Yes. He's got his private practice and he's so affiliated with the university. Yeah. I want to try something like that. Okay. But it will have to be in your union. But that way you can still I can still touch your school. So Namibia has a dental school. Yes, yeah. For the last six years, I think. Five or six years. They started with a bang, straight in straight into the industry, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:37:31

Interesting. Oh, so that might be your thing, academia and mix of private and academics.

SPEAKER_02 1:37:35

Yeah, and I mean that's good because maybe you get into this rut of you know, drawn four and whatever. We always we always joke about that, but maybe and it's good to get a change. Change is as good as holidays. So just to try to do something and then come back into it.

SPEAKER_01 1:37:51

Speaking of change, I mean, if you could change anything about dentistry, like the profession, just anything, random. Wow.

SPEAKER_02 1:37:58

Change anything.

SPEAKER_01 1:37:59

Yeah. Um, I guess you get along with your colleagues and things. Like, how's how does that work? Yeah, colleagues.

SPEAKER_02 1:38:07

Because Namibia is probably a small very small, very competitive. Um, we get competitive. We get along with with with um the colleagues, all right. So it's healthy competition. Yeah, no, it's it's um it's good. I mean, I think competition is healthy. You need it, you know, otherwise you end up as a slough. Yes, I don't know. What would I change in dentistry if um you caught me there, mate?

SPEAKER_01 1:38:34

Somebody used to say somebody somebody in campus, somebody in campus used to say, you know, dentistry is just great. Dentistry is easy if it wasn't for the patients. I think it was Danamo made the joke. Okay, but that's fine.

SPEAKER_02 1:38:48

Yeah, I wish I could see I could have x-ray vision.

SPEAKER_01 1:38:51

Right.

SPEAKER_02 1:38:52

Huh? Imagine that, eh? Why? Then you could see what you're doing the whole time. But you've got a C BCT, it's fine. Um, I don't have anything. No, that's that's fine. That's fine.

SPEAKER_01 1:39:03

I'll see you comment later. Let's move on to something lighthearted, lightning round type of thing. Oh no, I hate these. This is where this is where my you know where And here I've written down some. I mean Okay, okay, let's do this. So, what's one thing you wish patients, more patients understood about dentistry?

SPEAKER_02 1:39:22

Um I that's that it's it's we we really we're not there to hurt you, we're there to help you.

SPEAKER_01 1:39:30

Okay. You think that they they just think that we Yeah, I really think sometimes they think we're there to hurt them, you know? Yeah, but on that point, I I feel like I think patients just think that dentists are there to make money, like big money. I know. And if they only knew what the stuff costs, yeah. So that isn't that one thing.

SPEAKER_02 1:39:48

That's not actually joining it. Yeah, yeah, there we go. If they um maybe the cost of materials or something, you know, that's that's uh definitely something I would like to change. I already asked you that it's gonna happen.

SPEAKER_01 1:40:00

I already asked you this question about why do patients tell dentists that they hate dentists. We'll never know. You needed to get it out correctly. We'll never know. No. Best piece of advice you've ever received? If if something doesn't come to mind, it's fine.

SPEAKER_02 1:40:13

I'll move on to the next one. Best piece of advice. I think it was again from what Bullen said, you know? Just be kind, be courteous, and just be a good good guy. And the patients feel this sort of thing. I can't wait for him to watch this thing.

SPEAKER_01 1:40:27

I mean, we actually gotta get him on camera. Yeah, maybe we'll get him here one day. How did he convince Strite of all people to stay in? Um any book, podcast, movie that's impacted your life? Okay.

SPEAKER_02 1:40:45

Book definitely um it was it was I actually thought about it the other other days. I think it's fucked. I want to say James Wellison, but it's not. It's um it's a book called The Tipping Point. I just can't remember John Malquell. Okay, Max Max Malkwell, something, something like that. Right. Tipping point. It's uh definitely something to read, um, just helps you understand a little bit of psychology for um psychic of human being relation. Um another another book maybe is it James Gordon or something, he's a motivational. Um I can't remember the synonym right now or the name, but he he wrote a book on the 12 steps of life or something like that. It's very fantastic. Um, definitely if you um check check his podcast and that sort of thing. Do we listen to podcasts and stuff a lot? In the background, if you know if you if you've got hundreds of scans to go through, you've you just want to have a yeah to something else. But I like space things, that's cool. What's it? Space stuff.

SPEAKER_01 1:41:48

Like where are you what are you into the the cosmos and Neil deGrasse Tyson?

SPEAKER_02 1:41:53

No, not not so much then, but but I mean like history of of space stuff.

SPEAKER_01 1:41:58

I love his YouTube channel, man. He he interviewed um Lawrence Fishburne. Oh, what the guy the who's Lawrence Fishburn's the guy with Morpheus, right? Yeah, yeah. There's a one-hour interview with Neil deGrasse Tyson and Lawrence Fishburne. And Neil deGrasse Tyson is a huge Matrix fan. Of course. You must watch this thing if you're into Matrix and if you're into like that sort of stuff. Yeah. Fascinating interview, like talking about the Matrix. No.

SPEAKER_02 1:42:24

What was it? Blue and the Reds or something? Blue and the Reds?

SPEAKER_01 1:42:26

The blue pull and the red pull, yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay, here's another lightning question. If you could have dinner with any three people, living or dead, who would they be?

SPEAKER_02 1:42:38

Um okay, so so I'd like to I would I would have John Sternkamp.

SPEAKER_01 1:42:45

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 1:42:45

I know it's it's a political. John Sternkamp, the the D the D A guy. Yeah. Okay. I'd like to interesting. I'd like to pick his his brain a bit, you know, and just understand what he's going through and with the with the with the tron you know the trunk transition in this GN G U, right? Yeah. In this um country. Um probably Neil Armstrong is another one. Yeah. Um, I'd like to get a first hand account, what what was it like? I want to hear, I want to, you know, there's certain things that you can hear what they said on Vidence, but you you don't feel it. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:43:19

You know, that sort of thing. And then you don't know the backstory. I mean, look, if people looked at Gunterstrike now, they'll think they'll be like, okay, PhD student, successful dentist. Yeah. They wouldn't know all this stuff about the struggles and you know, all the backstory. Yeah, yeah. Which is why I'm grateful that you shared so um openly.

SPEAKER_02 1:43:41

I'm glad that you actually you you've done me a favor because you know I've actually never really I don't never spoken about myself to anyone. Um except obviously the wife, you know.

SPEAKER_01 1:43:52

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:43:53

Um okay, third person, maybe you.

SPEAKER_01 1:43:57

All right, all right. That's just Gunther just wants me to take him to dinner now. I pay pay for dinner afterwards here. We're in Joba, and he's staying um Monty. Monty. He flew down, you flew down just for the concert, eh? Yeah. And when you go back? Monday. Monday. Yeah. And so practice is closed Monday.

SPEAKER_02 1:44:16

Monday practice. Practice is just reception there, you know, your skeleton scarf. Okay. Scarf. Look at me. Stuff. But um, other than that, yeah, you need a break, eh? You need to take take some time out for for yourself.

SPEAKER_01 1:44:30

Do you work five days a week or seven days, six days a week? Six days, yeah. Monday to Saturday. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:44:35

But I do it's I take a lot of off time. Proper. I won't, I won't lie. Um, you know, with academics and stuff, I I try and make it a holiday as well. Yeah. So if we're going to Cape Town for something, I pack the kids, wife, everyone, and we go. You know. Um so you got a boy and a girl, yeah? Uh two girls. Two girls. But they are busy. Ooh. How old are? The one is um turning five now in Feb. And uh just a few days before your your one. Yeah. And the other one is two and a half. Okay. She is a demon. Two girls, eh? Two girls. I you know, I should have listened to my dad. Yeah. He said to me, you know, you better, you better be good and that sort of thing, otherwise you're gonna get your own back.

SPEAKER_01 1:45:20

And it happened. Oh yeah. Okay. Now, I usually ask the question, but I'll put it in this way now. If your if your girls come to you and say, Dad, I think you want to be a dentist. And I see you for the listeners, you've raised your eyebrows immediately. I don't know if you did it consciously or unconsciously. I think that was unconsciously. Subconsciously. Yeah. Let's just say they come to you and say, Dad, I want to be a dentist. Be honest, what would you say?

SPEAKER_02 1:45:47

Go for it. Really? I'll be honest, yeah. I I will make sure that I raise my girls to be strong, have strong depositions, strong personalities, and be m even more prepared than than what I was not growing up, so that they can make informed decisions, that they know what they're getting themselves into. And I'll and they can be anything they want.

SPEAKER_00 1:46:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:46:15

Anything. Yeah. And I will sit with them and then I will gladly explain because I think it is great that both my wife and myself, we we actually suppose studied at TICS. Yeah. So we and she also failed the second year. Okay. So we were just meant to be, you know. But that we can give our own accounts of what it's really like and tell them what you know that they can prepare themselves. If they still want to do it, do it.

SPEAKER_01 1:46:40

Okay. So you'll you'll support them 100% in anything. Yeah. And is anything like deep down inside you want them to become?

SPEAKER_02 1:46:48

Astronauts, mate.

unknown 1:46:50

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 1:46:51

I mean, I support Olympic swimmers. Olympic swimmers, yeah. But I mean, how cool. That is something I want to do before I pass on. I want to go see a rocket launch. Okay. Me too, we can. Not an U Glen. I want to see see, you know, and it doesn't matter actually. I'm just pulling a rocket launch. There's a rocket. I want to see some.

SPEAKER_01 1:47:11

Oh, I thought you said I thought you were going to tell me you want to go to space or something with like Elon Musk's um. Yeah, no, that's that's I wouldn't want my kid, my kids to be astronauts. I'd be too scared. Yeah. Be like, that's like, you know, you never know. It's gone. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So you say go for it. And and if anybody comes to you and says, I want to be a dentist, you'll adjust it.

SPEAKER_02 1:47:33

And I do it even to this day, knowing that I don't see. Remember in our final year, there was a guy that came, I don't know where he was from Galspread or something. And he said, and he actually really gave us a very depressing lecture. How we are all competition to each other. And remember that? No. And um maybe it's a good later. There's a handful of lectures that I remember.

SPEAKER_01 1:47:55

Yeah, yeah. In the whole world. Which one? But you remember one. Yeah. And it was probably when we were still in the medical with the medical um students. The guy came up. This is the only part I remember. Yeah. He said, Hi, my name is Dr. Cock, and I'm a sexologist. And he said, And that's not a joke. And he said, And that's not a joke. Everybody laughed. That's I remember that. Yeah. Then there was uh I think it was a pathology lecture with Dr. McKeakin. Well, Prof. Yes, the guy from New Zealand who used to swear like a pirate in every lecture. I loved him. Right? But his lecture, I remember he showed us the first slide, and it was a pathology lecture about like identifying um, you know, um when there's a motor vehicle accident and using um dental records to identify deceased and stuff when they burnt down. Yes. The first slide, I think he had a he had a whole um it was like a bunch of uh I don't know what's the collective noun for zebra, like you know, an investtic of zebras. But um and he said, Can you guys tell the difference between this a white zebra with black stripes or no? And he said the zebra can identify one another because they look all different to them because they're in the same species, but they're so that it's like as if you know how we recognize different humans. Yeah, and then the second slide he had was a slide full of one race, and he said, Can you and he's like, Don't don't feel bad. It's actually natural that all of these people look the same to you because but to them they all look very unique. So he was trying to explain how you know that is outward that I don't remember. So that's the lecture I remember. Yeah, like two of them.

SPEAKER_02 1:49:46

Wow, and everything else is just a blur. Well, maybe it wasn't, it's you know, it's not needed, you know. You sort of put it back, you know, like inside out, you know. It's just a blur to me. Put it back. One lecture I remember instinctively, Professor Apartu. Yeah, what about what about the prop? I could not understand. Oh, okay, okay.

SPEAKER_01 1:50:06

Yeah, but that was also um Physiology, second year. Yeah, that was also when we were in med school, eh? Yeah, that's a long time ago.

SPEAKER_02 1:50:13

You know, because of him, I had to get my Sovieton, I bought my Sovietson book and I started selling um physiology because I could not understand. Well, so the guy motivated you. Yeah, he did, he actually did it on unwillingly, unknowingly. Beware. What is what is that's that's undocurate physiology or saying beware of unintended consequences.

SPEAKER_01 1:50:34

Okay. Oh, and then there's also the one slide, don't let the sun set on pus. It wasn't our maxillo facial. Okay, yeah. Um because the University of Pretoria is a you know, a lot of Afrikaans, um, so English is not the first language for a lot of the some of the older lecturers, especially. And the slide, I won't forget it, because it says don't let the sun set on pus, meaning if you if there's an abscess and there's pus, you must drain it, right? Don't let it the patient go. Yeah, yeah. But it it was spelt P-U-S-S. So I found that hilarious. Um, and it's an easy mistake to make. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, anyway, Gunther. Yeah, man, thank you so much. It was fun. I had so much fun. Yeah. No, I don't. I was about to say, luckily, there's nothing to cut out really. Yeah. Um it was fun. Thank you for being so open and honest. And I think people are gonna appreciate the the how long was this now? I don't know. We checked, but it's probably been a couple hours. Uh it might have might actually be the longest interview. Okay, okay. Yeah. Yeah, we whitewashed this one, right? And uh and I hope that I hope that you have a safe trip here in Joe Burg. Enjoy the concert. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:51:48

What's it, offspring and offspring green day and Polisica. Yeah, Polisica. Have fun there. So trying to keep keep a PG 13.

SPEAKER_01 1:51:55

Yeah, I can't say the first part of that. And then yeah, safe flight back to how far how how long's the flight? About two and a half. Two and a half hours. Yeah. Not bad.

SPEAKER_02 1:52:03

This is domestic. I mean you've got it's like a holiday now, so so a few glasses of wine really smooth sailing.

SPEAKER_01 1:52:12

Namibia, so are you you inviting me? I can come stay with you there. Come over free accommodation. Yeah, come over. How much? Uh I just gotta clean. You just gotta clean and and watch the kids. Hey, you know, there's no such thing as a free lunch. No such thing as a free lunch. Okay, I'll see you in Namibia. Maybe we'll do a part two then. All right. Or maybe we'll get um Dr. Saskia. The the good wife one, yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:52:34

Talking about vet science, eh? Very interesting stories there. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:52:38

If she'll if she'll come on, I'll gladly have one. Yeah. That's it. Cool, man. All right, thanks a lot, bro. Uh had it fun. See you around. Oh man, my leg is now on.